Tubes ECC88/6DJ8? Need all the help I can get


Hi to all

I am about to get an hybrid amplifier, the new Logos from Pathos Acoustics. But I am completely new in this tubes thing. The only thing I know is that I might need to change the stock ECC88/6DJ8 tubes in order to get a better sound. Period. So, as you can imagine, I need lots of advising... So, for this type of tubes, what would you suggest? Someone told me to go for JJ Tesla tubes and that is all I have for now. Thanks in advance.
lisbon
Yes, ECC802S are simply 12AU7's that JJ Tesla designed specifically for Audio applications. They are in the same family and should work in any audio application that requires the 12AU7 tube. See them at the bottom of the 12AU7 list at the Tube Store link I listed.

AudioAsylum is certainly another good resource for information (as well as misinformation). The picture you describe is a very broad generalization, and is not an inaccurate generalization. But there are current production tubes that are excellent choices among specific tube types. NOS tubes are indeed counterfitted (plenty available on eBay to choose from:-). Tubes are also sometimes re-Branded. Also, many manufacturers have some tubes manufactured in different factories in different countries (ie just because it is a Telefunken doesn't mean it was necessarily made in West Germany). For instance, I have some Telefunken E88CC tubes that were made in a Mullard factory in Enland, yet they are marked Telefunken and are not counterfits or re-brands. I have Amperex 12AX7 tubes that are marked "Made in England", that are actually manufactured by Tungsram and were made in Hungary that have been re-branded. Both of these are excellent tubes BTW, even though they are not "accurately" labeled. On the other hand I have a GZ34 rectifier tube that is marked as GE made in England (which should be a Mullard-made tube), but it does not have the hole in the base (a sign of a genuine Mullard GZ34), and has a telltale raised "X" seam on the top of the tube indicating a Japanese counterfit. A very similar kind of "X" seam (though not identical) can also be found on legitimate Siemens tubes which are not counterfits. So, once again, it is good to deal with a tube dealer you know you can trust if you are new to this. Your searches here and on AudioAsylum should give you some good general feedback to go on regarding specific 12AU7 recommendations. Again, good dealers know their tubes VERY well also, and may even know your specific component. Always keep in mind, just as in all aspects of this hobby, there are no hard and fast rules and YMMV. Use your own ears and system to make your own judgements.
I absolutely agree with your last statement for (for all, not only tubes, audio matters). And yes I have seen these ECC802S at the bottom of the 12AU7 list at the Tube Store link. I must confess I like this "designed specifically for Audio applications" concept. But I have one other silly question... These tubes are sold seperately, by unit. What about tube balancing? I am sure I will be glad to talk to Jon also (thanks for the tip Jax2) when I feel prepared to replace my stock tubes for new (that is old) ones.
Most dealers will sell you a "matched" set of tubes if you request that (I think that is what you are referring to by "balanced"). Some charge a small fee to match tubes, and most have good equipment to accomplish that. Not a silly question. The more expensive tubes are often priced per unit.
But Imagine I am interested (not yet...) in a pair of NOS like the ECC802S. In this case, should I ask Jon to match the tubes? And is it safe to buy tubes from so far away(Portugal is the southest european country)?
Yes, if you are buying a set of more than one tube for a pre-amp it would be a good idea to ask the dealer for a matched set of tubes. Yes, you would request that specifically. There are good tube dealers in other countries and far and near. Some tubes are more delicate than others, but if packed well, in general, they should ship well by air. If you receive a tube shipment in the Winter when it is cold outside you should allow the tubes to acclimate to room temperature before using them. I've purchased several tubes from overseas sources with no incident and all tubes have tested well. I bought some tubes from someone who had purchased from a dealer in Hong Kong and those tubes were not only not matched well, but one of them tested bad (in need of replacement). The guy I purchased from ended up sending the two worst back to Hong Kong. I kept the other two from the quad. Those were GEC 12AT7's. Especially when buying tubes overseas you should definitely only buy from dealers who you know from reliable sources are reputable and will stand behind their products and service. You risk the hassle of an international insurance claim if anything is damaged, and for expensive NOS tubes it may not be worth the hassle. Shipping insurance in general is a royal PITA, and it's getting harder and harder to "prove liability" and get paid for a claim. This may be even more so with Vacuum tubes where damage is not always physically apparent. Shipping is obviously also more expensive from overseas as well. Portugal is indeed in the southeast of Europe....was that a question? It's a beautiful country! Don't know any tube dealers there though, that's not to say they do not exist. I'm sure that there are good and bad tube dealers in most of the industrial countries of Europe, just like there are here. Some of the more exotic NOS seem more readily available abroad, probably since most were manufactured there. The Japanese audiophiles love tube gear I'm told, and are a major consumer of tubes and tube hardware. They do make some pretty good tubes in Japan as well, but are also known as a major source of counterfit tubes too. Again, since you're new to tubes, I would stick closer to home for now and save yourself the potential hassle. Along with my recommendation of Jon through my many experiences buying from him, you can also find many recommendations for other good dealers, closer to you, on this forum as well as on AudioAsylum. Kevin Deal at Upscale Audio, as well as Andy over at Vintage Tube Services both have good reputations among those who have dealt with them. Kevin Deal does run a full service high-end audio store, and has been criticized on these forums (he has also received much praise here as well) for giving priority (rightly, IMO) to the products and sales that keep him in business, of which tube sales are only a tiny part. The upside of that, as I see it, is that he deals with a great variety of different components and knows about how tube selection affects specific components. Both Jon, and Andy are strictly tube dealers as far as I know. All they sell are tubes and tweaks. Jon has been able to give me excellent advice about specific components as well and was right on in his assessment. Again, I have no doubt that all three of these dealers could be a darn fine source for tubes and advice about tubes. I have no personal experiences to speak of with either Upscale or Vintage, but there have been many posts recommending both as excellent dealers. Any of the three will be able to sell you a matched set of tubes, and should be able to recommend specific tubes for you application.