Tenor Hybrid v. VTL MB-450 Sig.

I agree with you Zaikesman regarding Jim and RC. The more we hear from RC the better as far as I'm concerned.

As to your second point, I was implying nothing. What I said was clear and speaks for itself. Speakers that get the dynamic contrasts of music right include, among others, Merlin, Avantgarde and the mbl 101 series.

Jim2:
Zaikesman and I always seem to be on opposite sides of a discussion, but he is right on this one.

Suggestion: Rethink your statement.

KevinKwann as a Merlin owner, I agree that Merlin is excellent at dynamic contrasts but would further say the Sound Labs EXCEL at low level dynamic contrasts of musical instruments to a greater extent, I haven't heard it done better by any speaker. The Merlins are among the best I have heard in this respect and along with their tonal balance it is one of their great virtues. These speakers present very refined, defined pitch at low levels. I've heard some quite amazing bass from the VSM although it requires a a powerful amp with plenty of control to realize it.

So far as BIG dynamics, larger speakers are better at capturing this providing you have a room and it is treated properly but this doesn't always equate to real so much as more visceral, depends on your musical priorities I suppose. Furthermore, the VSM's are MUCH better suited to a small to medium sized room. Much more so than a large system IMHO. I ain't gonna argue with Bob Crump, I respect his hearing although I have never met him. His cables tell me a lot about how he hears and he also has the SoundLabs, not a bad choice.

Jim2, I like a larger presentation than the Merlins will allow, but have friend locally that had the Merlins set up with some old Entec woofers that did just about everything correctly as the size of the presentation was life sized, about 30% larger than using just the Merlins.....As far as amps go I would go with the Berning or Joule OTLs and buy some subwoofers and still have money left over from the 20K or keep the VTLs and buy some JM labs......JM will get the weight and size of a piano correct......

I used the Sound Lab M-1s at CES 2003 with my home system and noted they were cleaner than my Rockports and were definitely full range and cut a deal with Roger West as he wanted a preamp.......If I can get the focus and immediacy out of the Sound Labs here then I will replace the Rockports and if not I will keep both.....Unfortunately, nothing is perfect on an overall basis as Kenkwann points out as few speakers get the leading edge right.......You pick your poison and live with it for a while.......

i may as well chime in here:

as a former owner of VSM-Ms and good friend of rcrump, he heard my merlin-based setup many times and saw it evolve from decent to good to great. but the inherent limitations of the design remain---and that is what he took issue with, and incidentally that is why i sold them. they are, after all, a 2-way, and cannot do BIG (and venue = big) properly. ---also, they don't like loud volumes, big listening rooms, or listeners above axis. within these constraints, they're wonderful. outside, and you get the suggestion for different speakers (with their own new limitations).

rest assured that my new SLs are not perfect, and there's many aspects of the merlins that i'd prefer over the SLs, they were that good (if ever i needed another 2-way, i'd buy merlins no question). but the SLs full range presentation and reproductive ease (with the right amp---no small chore finding it) are a nice change from the limits i associated with the merlins.

i agree with bob that a change in amp will not get venue from the merlins. a sub will. i know--i did this w/ entec LF20s and it filled in the bottom nicely. and like bob, i have to question the logic of trading one world-class amp for another...my guess is there's other system problems that would need addressed before upgrading a top 10 amp to another top 10 amp.

rhyno