Stereo sounds better than 5.1?

5.1 is pure digital manipulation and fine for movies; But the technology is not there yet. 2 Channel music is light years better. Even the sound field (stage) does not work in 5.1 -- Imagine yourself sitting in the center of the New York Philarmonic, in a circle, with them all facing you while playing. There are certain sounds created by the orchestra playing together. This is destroyed in surround sound, because the instrument are coming at you from all directions. While very very interesting to listen to from a technical standpoint, it would grow tiresome quickly because it isn't "Music", just sound IMHO.

I would not consider that I have yet heard a great 5.1 system, while have heard some great stereo systems, so I guess that my final judgement on this will have to be up in the air for a bit.

As to my systems, I have integrated my HT setup with my stereo system. The stereo side of the system is decent, imaging is great, soundstage is beautiful, and overall I find it a joy to listen to.

The HT side of the system is on the high-end of low-end; speakers are different brand and lesser than front left and right. It is adequate for movies, actually better than many I have heard. But for music, it is just not there.

So I would be very interested in hearing some idea of what a reference 5.1 system would look like... What electronics, what speakers, what placement, room size etc.

Niels.

Well Urban at first I thought you might have been looking to have fun w/the 2ch guys. But know I realize that maybe your 2ch is just "well not to be rude, but your 2ch is not great." I for one thing think/know I have a very good surround system. DC-1/Bat vk200/All martin logans/pioneer elite dvd/cd and a sub. And believe me the ht is unreal. But when it comes to music my 2ch is better and then the surround (hands down). I love my ht, just as much as music. That's why very soon I will be adding a Bat vk30 tube preamp to the setup, for better 2ch. Right now my 2 channel sounds like surround. Yes 2 preamps give you the best of both worlds. O did I mention when I play 2ch everyone who comes over thinks its in surround mode, NOT. And I too have the hell freezes over DVD. And it is better in 2ch.. I think your 2ch needs alittle help. But have fun, this is what its all about.

I'm not going to say the YOU'RE WRONG, because different people have different things they listen for.

I agree that digital manipulation does assist movies. I've heard the full bore vandersteen signature surround system. I thought it was nice and did make movies and Hell Freezes Over more enjoyable. Unless you have a huge room and bank account where your screen is 6ft+ behind your peakers and you can have your surround sound system FEED your reference two channel setup, you will be compromising your music quality. Spending equal dollars, two channel far outperforms surround. I've heard 5-6 surround sound setups, the vandersteen setup being the best. I have yet to hear one that approaches the magical qualities of good 2 channel, especially a tube setup. I think a good two channel setup actually places images in a more solid three dimensional space than a home theater setup. Truthfully, I don't like surround sound for watching television/movies. I feel that it is just Too Much Sound being pressed at me and I find it tiring. I prefer having a small two channel setup on my television with TV supplied SRS.

By the way, on the topic of Adcom. I've owned the adcom 750, the pass labs aleph P, and the Audio Research Reference 1. I've also a/B compared these (in my system) to the vk30SE, and the audible illusions 3a. The 750 definitely earned its class A rating. It was not embarassed by any of these preamps. I preferred the adcom to the audible illusions. The pass labs is a little better. Some people get so snobby about names.....

Urban's response to these can be found on "multi-channel better than stereo" thread. Sorry I got 2 going on the same topic. Long story short "I screwed up", when it comes to computers I'm not the brightest bulb on the Xmas tree. From now on if you don't mind, just post on the other one.
Thank you and sorry.