Sistrum or Neuance or...?


I'm considering some isolation for my transport and DAC. Which of the Sistrum or Neuance do you recommend? Or what else? I'm certainly open to suggestions. Thanks.
budrew
As a mostly-lurker who grew weary of Sistrum's explanations long ago, I've got to say the more I read these explanations the more self-contradictory and less credible they seem. There is such a lack of rigor in Sistrum's efforts to explain the science of their product, you wonder why they don't just give it up and let the product stand on its performance, which after all many have said is very good.

It was interesting to have Robert of Starsound come on board to straighten things out and then say things like, a Sistrum platform is an active device because it vibrates. Starsound seems to take a lot of these kinds of marketing liberties in its technical explanations.

More surprising is the admission itself that Sistrum stuff vibrates a lot. We've read a lot of claims tantamount to saying that Sistrum racks are near-perfect conductors of vibrational energy, channeling all the energy to ground. We've been told Sistrum drains energy away, avoiding the futile sins of trying to absorb and damp energy. Now, Robert says that Sistrum racks vibrate "continuously and simultaneously [sic]," that the noisy Sistrum "rattle triangle" creates a multitude of freqencies, both above and below the audible range. Which is it going to be -- coolly conducting the energy to ground, or continuously and excitedly vibrating it off?

There's nothing new about the latter approach. One could argue that based on this explanation, Sistrum racks are damping devices, something that the more vocal Sistrum backers seem to think is the original sin. Damping devices absorb potentially harmful vibrations and throw off the energy at frequencies that will do much less harm (they certainly don't just absorb and absorb until they explode). That appears to be what Sistrum does.

Part of the problem with these discussions is that isolation vs. coupling and damping vs. conducting are fine dichotomies at the theoretical level but are not very useful labels at the practical level. I think any structure that's sturdy enough to risk putting your equipment on and practical enough so that you could take your equipment off of it without having to unweld it or something equally extreme is going to be doing some isolating and some coupling. Arguing about equipment as if they are embodiments of theoretical ideals is pretty useless, but it does reveal a tendency of audiophiles to want simple and elegant-sounding explanations that audio equipment marketers can and do take ready advantage of.

Lastly, in the face of criticism, Sistrum defenders often resort to saying something like, "Why don't you try it and see if you don't think it's great?" Finally, a half-way sound argument. But my and others' objections are not about Sistrum's performance. They're about the very questionable, science-like claims and explanations that, for some reason, Sistrum backers seem more devoted to forcing upon the rest of us than supporters of just about any other product. Their question seems to imply that if you were to try and enjoy a Sistrum product, than somehow that would prove that the line of science-like verbiage that Starsound puts out is valid.

I've been reading these pages long enough to know first-hand that Starsound came on the AudiogoN scene in a less-than-honorable way. There are at least a few calm Audiogon voices who speak highly of Sistrum equipment and don't indulge in the marketing nonsense, so I do think these products have merit. But to some of us, their marketing creates a very different image than I'm sure they'd like their product line to have. Robert provided an interesting explanation of the origin of the name, Sistrum, saying that the musical instrument called the sistrum was used ritually by temple chantresses to ward off the forces of chaos. Starsound's marketing definitely recreates the mood of this origin story. Please, I don't want to see a white paper, if it's more of the same. Let the product speak for itself.
Warren, the Sistrum is not designed for people like Sean nor myself. Our systems are complex. The Sistrum was designed to be marketed (and rightfully so) to a particular type of individuals. I knew it when I saw it in Lak's system. Try placing my little Channel Islands/Monolithic Sound components on a Sistrum--and please don't even consider putting them down. Ask Lak what sounded *significantly* better--my little $249 CI passive pre or his $3500 Presence Audio tube beast...
Hello Jay.Your right.. The easiest way to explain Sistrum is to have someone put it to use in their system. It then becomes the most effective means of communication.All the mis conceptions and predispositions melt away..Tom
Of course Jay is right! he points out the very essence of all this mess, of which you are a MAJOR contributor:

But my and others' objections are not about Sistrum's performance. They're about the very questionable, science-like claims and explanations that, for some reason, Sistrum backers seem more devoted to forcing upon the rest of us than supporters of just about any other product. Their question seems to imply that if you were to try and enjoy a Sistrum product, than somehow that would prove that the line of science-like verbiage that Starsound puts out is valid.
Mejames: I may have misinterpreted your original post as asking if i would be willing to measure / test one of these devices more-so than just demo it. I am not against trying any product. Then again, i will only invest my money into a product that i think is worthy of the expenditure to begin with, regardless of a money back offer.

Other than that, testing of such a product and obtaining meaningful results would require days on end of very rigorous and systematic analysis. I have neither the time, patience or "optimal" equipment to do such. While it is possible that i could perform some rudimentary tests and obtain results, i'm quite certain that if they didn't jive with what Sistrum and the Sistrum devotees expect, it would only further inflame the situation.

Jayboard: That was a very reasonable post that summed up much of what i've been "trying" to say. That is, the techno-mumbo-jumbo that Sistrum and their supporters keep foisting upon us does not add up and is actually quite a turn-off towards their products. Maybe the product does work as claimed, but i can see no reason as to why it could / should and they don't seem to be able to explain why it does, if it does. Sean
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