2. amps-preamps
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Clayton Audio Class A amps. Need amp advice

Hi Guys,

I am looking to change my amps and for a few reasons.

First because I just upgraded my DAC from the great PS Audio DirectStream to the incredible Bricasti M1 DSD USB DAC. I love the Bricasti and it has shown that in my system it could offer me more with a more resolving and neutral amp IMO.

I am currently am using the wonderful sounding CJ Premier 12 mono tube amps. I love them and tubes in general but my speakers are the great Ascendo C8 Renaissance and look to present a somewhat benign load being 88 efficient and 6ohm but they are unique and have an internal firing 21 cm Kevlar Bass driver that is great but stubborn and the speakers I think will really shine with a iron fist control of that driver.

I love tubes, always have and always will but I grown tires of a flabby bottom which is exasperated by a unique and somewhat difficult to grip bass driver set up I spoke about above.

I want an amp that can give me as much tube sound as possible but with Grip and bottom end. I know this is a lot to ask for in the used $5k to $7k price range.

I have read and it seem like the Clayton offer exactly what I am looking for but wanted to hear from some of you guys if anyone has ever heard them or know of them or anything. Any info would really be appreciated. Here is the info on my speakers and I will also list the rest of my system in case you think that is helpful. Thanks

C8 Renaissance
Technical Data
Principle
• Three-Way with SASB bass unit (TOS Off)
(current damped outer driver with semi symmetrical band pass)
• Four-Way with SASB bass unit (TOS On)
Dimensions (W/H/D)
• 28 / 80 / 40 (without Base)
• 28 / 108 / 40 (with Base)
Weight
35 kg
Frequency Range
29 Hz (-3 dB) – 32.000 Hz
Power Rating
350 W Program (min)
Impedance
6 Ohm
Sensivity
88 dB / 1W/m
Outer Chassis (COAX)
• 25 mm Neodymium-fabric-tweeter
• 18 cm Woofer with XP cone
Inner Chassis
• 21 cm Chassis, Kevlar cone
TOS Chassis
• Ribbon-tweeter
TOS Function
• switchable (TOS Unit - Dipole AN / AUS)
Sockets
• Single / BiWiring Base
Dimensions (W/H/D)
28 / 18 / 40 cm
Weight
11 kg

Ascendo C-8 Renaissance Speakers (Germany) Speaker
Purist Audio Design Corvus Praesto Revision 2.5m Bi-Wire Speaker cable
Darwin TRUTH Pure Silver Reference 1 Meter RCA Interconnect
Darwin TRUTH Pure Silver Reference 1 Meter RCA Interconnect
Bricasti M1 USB / DSD / Volume Control DAC (New) DA converter
Tellurium Q BLACK DIAMOND Reference USB Cable
Decware ZSTAGE External Triode Output StageTelefunken ECC801S
Audio Research REFERENCE 1 MK II w/Rhodium IEC/NOS Tubes Tube preamp
PS Audio PowerPlant Premier AC Regenerator
Conrad Johnson Premier 12 Mono's 140 Watts Tung-Sol KT120's Tube amp
Salamander Amplifier Stands (2) Synergy System AV Furniture Stand
BMI Shark Jeweler Grade Platinum 9 AWG AC Power Cable
Mad Scientist PC-NEO with Power Purifier 11 AWG Power Cable
Sablon Audio Petite Corona 2.0M 7 AWG AC Power Cable
JPS Labs The Power AC+ 2M 8 AWG AC Power Cable
Synergistic Research Labs Tesla Series SE T1 AC Power Cable
Synergistic Research Labs Tesla Series T1 AC Power Cable
PS Audio Noise Harvester (5) Converts noise to light
OYAIDE RI Beryllium Power Outlets (2)
Blue Circle Audio The Yalu Balula Industrial Surge/Spike Protection
JPLAY v5.2 hi-end audio player turns PC into a digital transport.
Fidelizer Pro Version 6.1
JRiver Media Center 19 Music Software
128x128Ag insider logo xs@2xfsmithjack
josefm
53 posts
 
"What do you guys think about the guy that builds the Hypex Ncore amps James Romeyn.

They seem like a great deal and are pretty much the same as the $4800 Thor from Merrill just without the fancy case."

No they are NOT the same. Different modules.
mechans
3,048 posts
 
I have no dog in this fight, but even if they share some common parts other elements are usually different. For instance capacitors vary widely with regard to SQ and which resistors you use, and the ratings of those components can differ. They may look a lot alike but be quite different. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt.
Arguing for the same except for the casework is the generally accepted knowledge that the case work in general and faceplates in particulars are frequently the most expensive element in an amp.
joeinid's avatar
joeinid
658 posts
 
There's no free lunch. Tubes and solid state will never sound the same.

Class D has gotten so much better, but in my opinion suffers from sort of a one-note bottom (some are better than others). Plenty of bass in Class D but not as much articulation and differentiation as from better solid state.

I am enjoying a Devialet D400, a hybrid Class A and Class D design. My D400 can not take place of my CJ GAT/ART monos, but it's a nice change and runs cooler for the peak summer months.

I often enjoy a tube preamp and SS amp or the opposite too. Tubes give the that tremendous 3D, depth, width, bloom, sweetness and air that no solid state can give you. On the other hand, SS give you that tight fisted control over bass and no tube worry.

My Devialet D400 as a dac/preamp into my CJ amps sounds amazing too. It's great to have options to help you appreciate what gear you truly love.

I love my Class A (Pass XA60.5's) on my SF Strads and Harbeth 40.1's, especially with my GAT tube preamp.

Nothing is perfect, I love and look for a great treble and midrange. I'll give up a little on the bass to get that musicality that I love.
aolmrd1241
1,042 posts
 
"06-02-15: Joeinid
Class D has gotten so much better, but in my opinion suffers from sort of a one-note bottom (some are better than others). Plenty of bass in Class D but not as much articulation and differentiation as from better solid state."

............................................................

I have to disagree with your bass remark. I believe you when you say some class D amps can have a 'one note bass' bottom end,but so do some tube amps and some A/AB amps I have heard over the years. I don't think it is so much the class of amp distinction per se... but rather the design implementation used in the amp.

I own the Merrill Audio Veritas mono block amps which are a class D design. These amps do the bass range like no other amp I have ever heard. They slam with total articulation of the lower registers... Of course I have not heard all amps out there but what the Merrills do is simply beyond reproach.
theduker's avatar
theduker
53 posts
 
I see we have gone a long way past the amp recommendations. Allow me to throw my two cents in.

You like tubes and power. You love your CJs. You want some bass control. You would prefer to buy used like so many of us.There are several ways to go here. You like Manley gear. I would like to recommend the VTL MB-300 that are used on the Gon right now. They have all you truly need, and power to drive about anything. I have a pair, and I am delighted. The only caveat is you should replace the filter capacitors ($40x4 from Digi-Key) and do a couple CHEAP factory updates since they don't seem to have been done... and wallah, you've got your new amps. They are incredibly underrated also very inexpensive, and there is no question they are more powerful than the Manley 250. Granted the Manley has the EL-34 but you won't miss that. The amps will be dead quiet once the old filter caps are replaced.

I wanted Claytons myself, but I didn't get them. Holding out for Pass Labs, but I'm happy with my tubes, and I have a lot of them. I have both ARC Ref 610t and VTL Wotans, in addition to ARC Classic 150s, and the MB-300. (I obviously like tubes.). You should be able to sell your CJ for what the VTL will cost you...
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