It Was 40 Years Ago Today...

I was away for a few days, and missed all the excitement!

Marty, I have the live ABBA CD, but haven't listened to it yet (it's only been, what, ten years? I have about 6,000 of them left from my days as the Indi CD buyer at a Tower Records store, most of them still sealed! I just sold 1200 of them to Amoeba records to fund my new Pickup Arm). And you're right Marty, ABBA's Bjorn & Benny were absolute masters of "the hook". Better at melodies than McCartney, and maybe even than Brian Wilson! If you like Pop, you must know of The Wondermints, Brian's touring Band. The original bassist Brian Kassan (he left right before they hooked up with Brian---doooh! They weren't doing enough of his songs) started a Group after he left that he named Chewy Marble. I play on about half of the second album, "Bowl of Surreal". He's a real good Pop songwriter and, like all members of the L.A. Pop scene, an absolute Brian Wilson worshipper.

I have to hand it to you Marty---you're the first person I've read say what I've long felt, that The Beatles were a Pop Group, not a Rock n' Roll Band. I love your brand of Pop/Rock (the term Power Pop has lost all meaning from overuse, hasn't it?). Don Dixon is a great producer as well as artist. I'll bet you like Marshall Crenshaw too. One of the best Bands I ever saw live was his 5-piece, in '82 at one of the New York clubs (The Peppermint Lounge, I think). He had Graham Maby (Joe Jackson's original bass player) on 6-string Fender Bass (the one from the 60's, with light-gauge strings, tuned an octave below a guitar), as well as standard 4-string electric bass, his Brother Robert on drums, and another guitarist (beside himself), and all of them sang. Fantastic!

The Fleetwood Mac I love is the line-up that did the Kiln House album. It was unusual (and welcome) to hear a pretty popular Group (especially British) doing music with such unashamedly American 50's R & R as it's source and inspiration. And in 1971, in the middle of a not-very-R&R era (the hippie bands saw to that). The Danny Kirwan/Jeremy Spencer guitar team was great I thought. I also like Lindsey Buckingham, and thought FM's huge success with him taking over was well deserved. I has seen he and Stevie live locally in '68, in their Group Fritz (San Jose had a LOT of Groups/Bands, being probably the Garage Band capitol of the country in the 60's. When The Doobie Brothers got their deal with Warner Brothers in '71, my Band auditioned for their former gig as the house band at the infamous Chateau, a biker bar up in the Santa Cruz mountains. We didn't get it).

Speaking of Chuck Berry Marty, for anyone unaware of the following guy, you absolutely must acquaint yourself with Dave Edmunds. Imagine a guitarist who perfected Chuck Berry's guitar style, sings as well as just about anyone (plus arranging harmony parts as well as anyone this side of Brian Wilson), and is a superb record producer (for The Flamin' Groovies---the great "Shake Some Action" album, the Fabulous Thunderbirds, The Stray Cats---don't hold that against him!, Rockpile---he and Nick Lowe's supergroup, and many, many more. One of Rock n' Roll's all-time greats!

I forgot one thing. I agree with you Marty, my description of the ingredients necessary for a recipe to be Rock n' Roll IS too narrow, and was said mostly as a means of explaining why I don't consider what Springsteen does to being R & R. While the definition fits R & R's original incarnation (the Sun Records artists), R & R, being a hybrid Pop music, is free to evolve, incorporating new elements and influences, and discarding old ones. There remains, however, a minimum requirement of those original ingredients needing to be present in a music to fit any definition of it, and I don't think Bruce's music meets that minimum. That alone doesn't make it "good" or "bad", it was just a topic of intellectual discussion!

I'm a huge fan of both Dave Edmunds (particularly with Nick Lowe in Rockpile) as well as Marshall Crenshaw whose playing skills matured over time in a very impressive fashion.

As to old Mac vs New Mac, I'm a guitarist and songwriter who has studied the band at each iteration to within an inch of its life. I will stick with my position - you haven't listened to Nicks and/or Buckingham very carefully if you think that they are the "bubblegum team" (your words) that sank the band.

Martykl...I agree with you 100% about Fleetwood Mac. I have seen several times before the Buckingham/Nicks era and MANY times since. The newer incarnation was, IMHO, one of the best bands to grace the stage.

I truly love virtually every version of Fleetwood Mac that's ever seen a stage or tracked a tune. (The "faux" Mac stand-ins who toured in the mid-70s per some contract dispute might be excepted). IMO, Peter Green was arguably the best of the Freddie King guitar lineage (tho those who prefer Clapton, Santana, Knopfler, Mick Taylor, Stan Webb et al all have a case). From the get-go, Fleetwood Mac was special, IMO.

As stated earlier, I'd argue that Danny Kirwan is a sadly overlooked songwriter, player, and (perhaps first of all) arranger of songs for guitar. My first public guitar performance was my own acoustic arrangement of Kirwan's song "Dragonfly" (from BDP's preferred Kiln House line-up). I also believe that Jeremy Spencer is the living spirit of Elmore James.

As Mofi notes, the classic Christine, Lindsey, Stevie line-up can make a strong case as the best of the lot, because they do more things well than any other iteration. They truly are masters of a huge range of styles - from pure pop to blues (on the too rare occasions they go there) to punk to pretty much everything you can think of.

In the end, I listen to what my mood dictates. Songs like Man of the World, Black Magic Woman, Green Manalishi, and Oh, Well are all in regular rotation in my listening room. As are later albums like Tusk, Rumors, Say You Will, Tango, and The White Album. Along with mid period albums like Heroes, Kiln House, and (especially) Mystery to Me.

Lindsey Buckingham is such a bizarre and fascinating guy (not to mention otherworldly guitar player) that his stuff (both Mac and solo) is first among Mac members for me. My intention was never to dis Peter Green, et al, but rather to argue that Buckingham (first and foremost) and Stevie Nicks were not responsible Fleetwood Mac's "pop sell out" per the popular narrative we've seen repeated here. They certainly polished up the erratic blend of pop sounds that Mac had adopted after the departure of Green, Kirwan, and Spencer, but they didn't make Mac a pop band. That happened before they joined.

I envy Andrew in that I never saw the Green, Kirwan, Spencer line-up perform live. I do love the dozen or so live albums of that iteration of the band that I own. I also believe that the Stevie, Lindsey, Christine version is a monster live band. In the end, I don't want to toss apples in favor of oranges. I'll enjoy the whole fruit salad.