B&W 803D crossover caps

Dhl: My project was really different than yours, and it is not a direct comparison at all. Sorry if I failed to make that clear.

Tweeter upgrade was only drivers. I had already started with the S/G/O, so my only variable was the driver.

Midrange upgrade was only capacitors. I originally had a single Solen cap and replaced it with six Mundorf M-Cap Supremes. No further comparison. I went about as far as I could go, given the large cap values of the mids. I think that set me back about $900.

Sorry I have no direct comparisons between other caps.

Giving it another try to help here, after re-reading your scenario. For my project, I read all the cap shootout opinions and took my chances. My beryllium tweeters really like the SGO, but I cannot say more. Absoutely zero objections.

For the mids, I read in more than one cap comparison report that M-Cap Supremes shine in the midrange. After a lengthy break-in, I can agree, although I hear more lower-mid pronouncement than upper-mid (in my rig and in my room- an extremely important qualification that cannot be ignored). I also seem to recall reading that M-Cap Supremes, in crossover applications, yield a better result than EVO, which led me to the M-Cap Supremes for my midrange caps. For about $200 per speaker, you can try two 18uF plus one 10uF, which will yield nearly your 47uF target. To me, it makes sense to try that one first. Took about 20 hours to sound decent, and 50 hours to sound good. After that, they just kept getting better, with more sound and detail coming through. But that was compared to the Solen cap.

Good luck, and please keep us posted.

Ptss:

If you are referring to the Spectral posts, there are three parts because WB forum had a limit on photos per post.

Here are links to all three parts:

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?18147-Spectral-DMC-10-mods

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?18148-Spectral-DMC-10-mods-part-2

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?18149-Spectral-DMC-10-mods-part-3

Rtilden:

I am kind of where you were at. I would like to make a change, but not really mess around with a lot of trial and error swapping stuff in and out. If I could have gotten a general consensus that a particular option was a no brainer improvement, I would have gone that route.

But now it looks like that is not the case so I will probably stick with two mods, the 47 and the 4.7. For the 4.7, I will try the Clarity MR in comparison to the stock Supreme SG. I would like to also try a Jupiter copper/wax/paper but the cost of entry is quite high.

Regarding the 47 I hear what you say but a stack of three parallel caps just will not fit. So practically I am left with the EVO or EVO/Al-Oil or EVO SGO. The EVO Al-oil was suggested by Tony Gee's review but I am actually leaning toward the SGO. Since the EVO Al-Oil is not that expensive, perhaps the reasonable thing to do is to try that first, then maybe the SGO. Then once the mid range choice is selected, try the Clarity MR in the tweeter 4.7 position.

Supremes have a real advantage technically over the EVO in that they are two series capacitors interwoven, which reduces the series inductance of the overall capacitor. The EVO is a conventionally wound single cap, but is more compact because it is not really 4 caps in one like the Supreme.

What I cannot rationalize from a fundamental POV is what difference the materials combos make. Aluminum metallization with and without oil vs silver metallization with oil vs silver/1% gold with and without oil. Clearly silver and silver gold are much better conductors than Aluminum, but the metallization thickness matters too. The silver/gold should have a better (lower) DF if the metal was a better conductor, but Mundorf's DF data do not support this. So maybe the Al films are much thicker than the Ag/Au, offsetting any advantage in bulk conductivity.

I suspect the gold is added to the silver to reduce any tendency for corrosion of silver. Silver is not really that "noble" in that it easily forms chlorides and sulfides (tarnish), and these may be formed by chloride or sulfide impurities in the oil (or in outside air contamination if it gets into the cap). Gold, even in small percentages, may reduce the tendency to form these compounds. That is why I prefer the silver gold alloys from a basic longevity perspective, although people's impressions of sonic performance are another matter.

Oh, and one other point. B&W went with a Supreme SGO (10 mFd) as a bypass/parallel cap across the mid driver, but an MKP in series with it. I always wondered why they did this, but now realize that the series cap is in series with a very large outboard inductor (1.25 mH). So why spend a lot for a low inductance cap like the Supreme if you are going to put a large inductance in series with it? The parallel bypass cap, however, is directly across the driver so low inductance will pay off there.