Has anyone heard the new North American products preamp and amp?

800db?? Lesse... 700 db is 10 to the 35th power or so... 800 db is 10 to the 40th power. Obviously the statement is ridiculous.

No wonder you don't have a means of measurement.

Now the problem here of course if that you have a circuit that can do the process, but no means of measurement, as nothing exists that can deal with numbers that small. Imagine a voltage that is 0. followed with 39 zeros after the dot before we see any significant digits and we see right away that no instrumentation anywhere in the world is that sensitive.

I hope the contradiction is obvious and not lost on anyone?

Occam's Razor says there is a much simpler explanation.

Roger, it might be that you have build some equipment that sounds good, and that being the case there is no reason to concoct these stories. Just let the qualities of the gear stand on its own. Other people's testimony is always far better than that of the manufacturer! OTOH, when you make comments like this, credibility suffers (to say the least) when read by people that went to school. The more you try to explain it, the deeper the hole you have dug yourself into.

atmasphere, since I started this thread making exactly your main point, namely let this amp prove itself, as it has with all the first adopters, you are the point who is digging a hole for yourself, as you have no credence in discussing how it works. I think Roger is telling critics like you far too much. I personally have no use for EEs as that field has greatly regimented positions that we know everything. The best amp and preamps are not by EEs. Mainly those well versed by the US military training in electronics dominate the innovators. 

I do agree with you that Roger should let you guys die on the vine. When more people hear these units, no erstwhile credentials will give any of you, credence in its merits.

Hey, you can’t have it both ways. If Roger enjoys doing it and wants to discuss it that’s actually what audio forums are for, no? Nothing like new technology to stimulate the old brain cells my granddaddy used to say. Now that the cat is out of the bag I say let’s go for it, and carry on the discussion. So far you guys are giving us the old Mutt and Jeff routine, one says go, the other says stop. I’d be interested in details of the quantum mechanics involved. So far I only see the name quantum mechanics dropped, as it were. Let's talk turkey.

cheers,

Geoff Kait
Machina Dynamica
No Goats No Glory

atmasphere, since I started this thread making exactly your main point, namely let this amp prove itself, as it has with all the first adopters, you are the point who is digging a hole for yourself, as you have no credence in discussing how it works. I think Roger is telling critics like you far too much. I personally have no use for EEs as that field has greatly regimented positions that we know everything. The best amp and preamps are not by EEs. Mainly those well versed by the US military training in electronics dominate the innovators.

I was just trying give some advice, which is based on experience. Its clear that Roger is new at this. If what he is saying is true, the problem he is up against is if he talks about it, the only ones that will believe him are those that have no education. That is how the industry is. Its a rapid way to being discredited!

So you might want to think about that, since you obviously misinterpreted my post. I'm one of the first to admit that I don't know everything, and I too am offended by 'audio engineers' that claim that everything is known about audio when it clearly is not. If you care to look into it, you will find that I make this point fairly often in that one of the areas that we know very little about is how the human ear/brain system works. And because we don't know much about how it works, we don't really design equipment that takes advantage of those rules. This is a reason why you can't look at a spec sheet and sort out how the equipment sounds- the only way to do that is by audition.

I've had nothing to do with the military in my career. I really feel like you made up some stories about me and then posted as if those stories were true.

atmasphere, perhaps I was painting with too broad a brush. I apologize.
   Physics and EE were two of my undergraduate majors but then I got involved with computers and using the scientific method to illuminate how people vote and why most state policies don't have any impact. This for 45 years was my career. 
  Early on I was quite impressed with Roger Paul's first preamp. That original thread has had several million readings many saying that he was selling snake oil. That was ridiculous in my opinion. 
All that I can really recommend is that you might want to give this amp a listen. 
  I was very impressed at CES with the Zanden suite because it had a very wide sense of the location of musicians. It cost $753,000! Rogers amp give symphony orchestras a full display from extreme left to extreme right. This is far wider than the Zanden system did and at a very small fraction of the price.