How much gain is needed in a Phono Preamp for a 0.2 to 0.3mv low output moving coil?

Thanks, Analogluvr.  Good to know.  What I was recalling may have been the second of the two posts dated 4-22-2013 by member Czbbcl in this thread.  Apparently he was wrong.

Best regards,
-- Al
 

If the noise floor is low enough 57 db might be fine.

But the phono gain isn't the whole thing. The gain in the line section, the gain in the amp and finally the efficiency of the loudspeakers all make a difference!

So if you have 57 db, a passive volume control and 89db speaker it won't work in most cases. So you need to add up the gain in the electronics and see if that will give you enough sound pressure.

How much gain for 0.2 mv MC ?  It depends on the gain in your line stage and your amplifier, but I would say 60 db is a good starting point....I wouldn't go any lower, unless your line stage has 15 db of gain or better itself.  If you use a buffer / unity gain line stage (First Watt B-1, etc.), then you need more like 75 db.  The Pass Phono (XP-15 and XP-25) stages can provide that much gain with very low noise.  

Most toob phono stages give 50-60 db, and the quietest ones either use a step-up transformer or JFET's on the input stage (like the Pass solid state designs).  55 db is enough for a normal 0.5-0.6 mv MC, but marginal for a lower output cartridge.

Dynavector or Ortofon MC. The best you can reasonably afford. You will be set for years. As I recall the LOMC versions of each are 0.30mV++++ for both.

Thanks again, I keep reading all the good words regarding the AT Art9. When I owned audio stores years ago we sold AT cartridges along with Grado, Denon, and Shure. The best one AT made was $150 and had a Shabata stylus. Compared to the others we sold and got in for demo the AT sounded the worst. I would prefer a LOMC most are around 0.3mv and 60 db of gain is max on most phono preamps and you have no room to upgrade to a cartridge with lower output. I emailed VPI and Marc sent me back a nice email about cartridges on the Prime. He said the Ortofon, AT, or Dyna are good matches for the TT. There are probably others but I only asked about the 4 mentioned.  Didn't have any experience with the Benz on the 3D arm. I wish the Manley had more ourput. One just popped up for $1500 for an older one. It might end up being the Herron only because it gives me more options.