Help w/ preamp


Hey guys!

A while back I posted about my search for an amp...I got a ton of great suggestions and had decided on demo'ing Parasound and Anthem. I found a local Parasound dealer here in Pasadena, and I was FLOORED. I have been using a Marantz SR 7011, connected to a full Martin Logan setup: Ethos fronts, motif x center, motion 40 rears. I felt like I had never really heard my speakers once they cranked up the Parasound. I told them my budget and they introduced me to the KRELL CHORUS 5200....man, oh man. They had a floor model for sale, as they were making room for a new 7 channel. The sound was similar, but I felt like the bass had more punch, and they made me an amazing deal - something I have yet to find online (lucky me I suppose).  So, after that long story...here's a few questions:

1. I am currently using RCA instead of XLR, as the Marantz AVR doesn't have both. I am sure I am losing some audio quality here correct?
2. I am thinking about adding the Martin Logan AFX (atmos) speakers soon - but since the Krell is 5 channels, I would have to run them through the Marantz - is that a "bad" idea?
3. The store I bought the Krell from recommended I swap to the Marantz 8802 as a pre, and use a 2 channel amp to power the atmos - something like a Parasound A23, which I see fairly cheap on here. Or, I could just sell my 5200, and buy a 7200 (there's a good one on here).

I guess, my main concerns - will the sound seem "different" or "uneven" getting amplified from different sources? Whether it be Krell + Marantz, or Krell + Parasound. And, would I be losing quality running anything through the AVR (I know they are just atmos speakers, but still) as opposed to using a dedicated power amp?

Any and all advice is appreciated. Thanks@

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@auxinput, yes, I would consider used. would just need to sell my 7011 as well :) 

@randy-11, i have a very short cable run - the AVR is one shelf above the Krell - so I could be okay w/ RCA?

i am thinking of doing some room treatment - its a living room w/ all wooden floors and several big windows...though, they're typically covered by drapes when watchign movies. i am thinking a good first addition would be a floor rug. think that would help at all?

I’ve always had better results with XLR cable, even if it’s just 3 feet. Since the AV7703 and AV8802a are both fully balanced/differential internally, I would think the XLR balanced cables would be superior when compared to RCA cables of the same quality/level. You could certainly use your existing RCA cables until you have time/funds to switch to XLR.

A large area rug is definitely a good thing here.  Once beyond that, use room treatments conservatively because you can definitely over-damp the room and the highs become dead.  I use a combination of  Owens 703 FRK for the front/back walls because it has a metal foil foil layer that reflects mids/highs.

@auxinput, I've heard that too and have no problem using them. But that will come when/if I swap to a pre instead of AVR. Which is my big dilemma. Maybe a more immediate fix would be cabling and adding a rug? I'm using AQ rocket 44 cabling that I got from Magnolia.. 
@auxinput, I have also considered switching to the Anthem AVM 60. Do you have thoughts on that pre? I have seen nothing but stellar reviews, but when I demo'd their power amp, I wasn't blown away. Granted, this would not be doing what the amp was supposed to do.

I have honestly had some 4K pass through issues w/ the 7011, which is partially why I also want to upgrade/swap. For some reason, NONE of the rear HDMI inputs will support 4K from my Oppo 203 or PS4 Pro. When I use the front HDMI port, it works. But on the PS4, it only allows one of the 4K resolution types to display...its quite odd. Neither Marantz nor Sony has an answer. I figured upgrading to a pre that solely focuses on video could alleviate the problem. 

Sorry for all the questions - I almost bought an Anthem a while back, but I have no way to demo it....

First thing, I am not a 4K expert. I only know that if you want to support 4K with all the new features, you need to go with one of the big company items (i.e. Sony, Marantz, Anthem). There are some boutique companies supporting 4K, like Krell, Theta, McIntosh, but they all have additional quirks and cost issues. (i.e. Krell Foundation has no Atmos, Theta is insanely expensive, McIntosh is buggy firmware with no support). I don’t know what to say about your issue other than it sounds like a firmware issue with regards to certain 4K standards. One thing you could try is getting a different HDMI cable. The higher bandwidth used for 4K can be a problem if the HDMI cable cannot charge/discharge fast enough for the digital square wave pulses at that speed. This could translate into communications between source/processor glitching and lost data. Maybe try a Wire World HDMI cable?

I have taken a quick look at the AVM 60. I have not heard it, but I would place it -probably- as equal to the Emotiva XMC-1. It is probably very nice sounding, but there are definitely better. Anthem is more of a boutique company and the AVM 60 comes in at $3k. Whereas Marantz company (D&M) has over 200 R&D engineers for their product development and has a huge reseller market. The Marantz is going to give you more per dollar than any boutique item. I think Anthem had a lot of success with their $9k D2 processor, so they took the software and put it in a very trimmed down platform so that they could sell it at a lower $3k price. My gut says that the 8802 (and possibly even the 7703) are going to sound better. But again, I have not listened to it.

Subjectively again, there are boutique processors that will beat the 8802a. The $9k Classe SSP-800 sounds better than the $4k Marantz 8802a, but Classe doesn’t support 4K, atmos, etc. And it’s $5k more expensive. The ~$6-7k Krell Foundation may or may not be better -- it’s controversial (some say it’s better, some say it’s not). Marantz 8802a is not as good as $12k McIntosh MX151, but it’s close.

There is a huge amount of positive reviews on AVM 60, but remember it’s all relative. For the money, the AVM 60 give you a whole heck of a lot. Many people love the Anthem room correction system. But like I said, it’s all relative and it’s a great product at the $3k level.

I auditioned the Emotiva XMC-1, which also had a huge amount of positive reviews (like stating that this thing is just awesome sounding). What I found was that the XMC was very very good for the money spent ($2k at the time), but it would not beat out my 15 year old Krell HTS, even when the XMC was playing hi-res through HDMI.  The Emotiva had a somewhat closed-in sound (common on their preamps/dacs) and did not have the "separation-of-instruments" clarity I wanted. The XMC-1 will soon be at the $3k level because of new features (HDMI2.0/4K support, Dolby Atmos, DTX:S, Dirac Live room correction).