coupling or decoupling of vinyl to/ from platter


Dear all,

I'm puzzled by a number of claims about record clamps and mats. 

I own an old Rega Planar 3, and I was reading about the importance of coupling the record to the platter, to add effective mass to the record to reduce vibrations, slippage etc, and improve the solidity that the groove "image" presents to the stylus. 

I also read about the importance of de-coupling the vinyl from the platter to prevent the transmission of unwanted vibrations from the motor. Rega has a very dense platter made of glass with a fluffy felt mat on top. So, felt to decouple lp from platter, is that right? 

Then, I purchased a cork Music Hall mat, which has a dozen raised cork discs on the mat to BOTH "decouple" the lp from the platter and "grip" the lp.  Music Hall claims that clamps are unnecessary with this mat because coupling discs, etc. I also, without knowing this, purchased a Rega Michell record clamp. The clamp seems to do good things regardless of the mat, and of course evens out warped records a little bit. 

There needs to be, it would seem, a clear objective answer to all of  this from an engineering perspective. Coupling does x, and decoupling does y.  If you look at all the high-end turntables, they have massive platters and clamps. So coupled mass is good for flywheel effect and also  for presenting a solid "image" to the stylus? 

Either Rega and Pro-Ject are dead wrong with felt mats, and have been runaway successes in spite of this, or the felt is adapted to their setup: weak motor, relatively light but super-dense platter, and decoupling felt to manage the motor and rotational noise transmitted up the spindle, and to hell with coupling?  

I did some quick and tentative experiments with the Music Hall mat and clamp vs. Rega felt mat with clamp. I need to do more comparison. The results are different but hard to characterize. I'll post again with more comprehensive subjective tests. 

From an engineering perspective, which should be best, Rega clamp w felt, Music Hall mat by itself, or "screw the mods, Rega it great just the way it is, heretic!!!" ?

Let the games begin!

Paul

paulburnett
I had the Planar II with the 10mm glass platter - it rung like a bell - sounded awful.

I also tried the sorbothane mat  and it quelled the ringing and I was happy :-)

Or so I thought, but when compared to other TT's it sounded lifeless

I've since ...
- ditched the glass platter for an acrylic platter - no mat and no more ringing
- added a Thorens Stabilizer weight - to keep the album spinning with the platter (not slipping) - improved dynamics
- replaced the plastic sub-platter with a metal one- improved clarity
- replaced the plinth for something that actually works - it stops ALL vibrations
- replaced the arm with one that actually works well - it got VTA :-)
- OK - the lid works well - so I kept that - and the on/off switch

The result: - clear, detailed, dynamic and precise reproduction.

It's no longer "a Rega"

 BUT, I'm really happy :-)

Regards - Steve



I've also been curious about this. I have a Pro-Ject Debut Carbon DC Esprit SB with an acrylic platter. It shipped with a felt pad and I've used it with, and without, the pad, but never really paid attention to any sound quality or noise differences. However, I've seen a few very nice leather pads that look awesome, are thinner and should provide a bit better traction for the LP on the platter.

Anyone have any comments on using a leather pad? Also, I'm not currently using a clamp/weight. Is this something I should try? Is a simple weight OK? I don't want to put too much pressure on the spindle every time I install the device.
Rueben - I don't have any experience with leather pads, but given that your turntable has isolation feet, and MDF plinth and acrylic platter, you're already pretty much where you want to be and I would avoid using the felt mat altogether.  Just make sure that your vertical tracking angle is appropriate.

If your pro-ject has the threaded spindle, the threaded clamp that pro-ject ships with some of their higher-end tables would be a nice addition as it allows you to set the pressure precisely.

One other thought for this thread (that was alluded to earlier) is that vinyl is usually the best coupling surface.  I'm surprised that people with glass/ MDF, metal platters don't simply use an unwanted LP as a platter mat.

Greg
@gregkohanmim - Thanks. I do not have a threaded spindle, hence my curiosity about using a weight. I’ll take the felt back off and take a listen without it. Not sure the Pro-Ject carbon tonearm that comes on the Debut Carbon has a VTA adjustment. I’ll check again to see if I can find any information about VTA adjustment for this arm.
reubent
... I do not have a threaded spindle, hence my curiosity about using a weight ...
FYI, there are clamps that work without a threaded spindle. KAB makes one, the Record Pig is another.