My apologies_Upgrade path from Wilson WattPuppy 7's?


Folks-

I am the naive person who posted about which speaker to buy next, my system is all McIntosh, except for the downloaded high-resolution music content. Since I have price limitations, I have been attempting to audition loudspeakers under $15K, preferably used or demos. In various stores, I have heard the following:
  • Vandersteen Quarto CT's: Great bass, but an active system that does not seem to resolve high mid-range strings like a Wilson;
  • Triton GoldenEar Reference;
  • Sonus Faber Venere S and Olympica's, great sound in the store.
Currently, I am auditioning (in-house) Wilson Yvette speakers (it cost $400 for an in-house demo), and they sound great to me, but they are too expensive, even at a reduced demo price.  I started comparing frequency and impedance curves where I could obtain them (mostly Hi-Fi news from the U.K.), but I am becoming too obsessive about this.

So, I guess I could buy the Wilson Sabrina or Wilson Sasha WP (discontinued Series 1), since I seem to like the Wilson sound. Any advice?

Thanks again - Gerry
128x128Ag insider logo xs@2xgerryah930
George, yes I saw that figure in the review of the MC275 V.

First, that figure is based on the 16 ohm tap (!), which per JA’s measurements has an output impedance of 0.87 ohms, which is well over twice as much as the 0.33 ohm output impedance of the 4 ohm tap (which is the tap that I presume would generally be used with most Wilson speakers). (Note that references to the 8 ohm tap appear identically in the captions beneath figures 1, 2, and 3, which is obviously a mistake, but the text makes clear which tap each figure applies to).

Second, the frequency response variation that is shown for the simulated speaker load, even with the 16 ohm tap, is within a range of about +0.4/-1.0 db, which doesn’t seem to me to be a big deal. Especially given that the dip of -1.0 db just occurs in a fairly narrow range of frequencies centered at a fairly high frequency, about 5 kHz. And for the 4 ohm tap the variation is within a range of an almost negligible +/- 0.25 db, as stated in the text.

Third, as I mentioned the output impedance of the MC275 VI is probably significantly less than that of the V.

Fourth, 0.33 ohms is a very small fraction of the impedances you quoted from Stereophile for the WP7:
Its impedance drops to 2.4 ohms at 78Hz and remains below 6 ohms for much of the region where music has its maximum energy (fig.1). In addition, an impedance of 4 ohms at 59Hz is associated with an electrical phase angle of -34 degrees, which will add to the drive difficulty.
Finally, as JA said in the review of the V:
... the modification of the McIntosh’s frequency response due to the interaction between this source impedance and the impedance modulus of the loudspeaker was relatively mild.
Regards,
-- Al

Ok here is the (misprint 8) 4ohm tap (gray) into the easy NHT simulated load, the Wilson will be significantly worse, probably double as bad. Especially around 100hz where the 7’s are 2ohm and -40 negative phase angle, which could equate to a EPDR of nearly 1ohm!!!! as seen by the amp.
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If you like the sound not flat in frequency response, then good for you Al, I know you like your tubes, but the line has to be drawn somewhere between what your hear is the a flat FR, or one that’s very contoured the, 275 will be different in sound with all hard to drive speakers, such as the 7’s ect.
https://www.stereophile.com/images/archivesart/1010Macfig02.jpg

Cheers George
Here is how the Boulder amp behaves into the simulated easy NHT load, note the grey scale is almost the same as the pure resistive ones. This is how an amp should behave into the NHT’s easy simulated load.
Yes it will be a little worse into the WP7’s but nowhere near as bad as the Mac 275 would be.
https://www.stereophile.com/images/217B2150fig1.jpg

Cheers George

Most of you know my protestations about Audiotroy's comments that consistently appear in threads about Wilsons. It's not about defending Wilsons. We all have our tastes in speakers and Wilsons are certainly not for everybody.  If I were an ATC, Raidho, Eggleston or Rockport fan (and I am, big time) and Audiotroy was constantly invading those threads to sell his wares, I would have the same problem.
Well Gpgr4blu, the OP got in his hoverpack from whichever state he is in and sped over to our shop and purchased two dozen pairs of speakers because of our suggestions. The reality is that I have no idea where Gerry lives and he has not contacted us so it doesn't look like he is coming. 

How about, you making some relevant suggestions, if the man has all the issues he has stated with Wilson what is your suggestion that he should do?

As some of the posters suggested he should change his amp,  and then he still may some of the same issues he is having. 

By suggesting the Legacy or Persona you have totally different products which work well with  his amplifier and both of these speakers are magnificent and highly rated.

The Legacy is more WIlson like then the Personas, with a big full rich sound, and with a Wavelet the speaker is totally customizable to match his room's acoustics, and taste. 

So now lets move away from your negative comments about my company, please offer a sages advice on what Gerry should do as he is clearly not convinced  and has found his next set of speakers.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ