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Upgrading path from Merlin VSM black magic

Goal:
I have been tinkering with the idea of upgrading and investing in floor standers that are superior in every way compared to Merlins. What are the Merlin users upgrading to? budget is 25k or under (used market value).
My present system:
I am using my Merlins VSM Black magic with dual BAMs with Coincident tech Frankenstein mono block amps (300B SET) and coincident tech line-state and phono preamp. Whole system is wired with Cardas clear cables. Using EMM XDS-1 and VPI classic turntable. System was built around Merlins. I suppose I might have to pick electronics suitable for the replacement speakers and in that case will build the whole system again. Preferably, I would like to keep the front end electronics/amps/pre-amp etc.
My music taste:
I listen mostly Jazz, Classical and vocals. 
My room:
I had Merlins setup in 12x16x8 room which was fully treated. I have since moved to a larger-ish space 15' x 21' x 9'. The room is not treated yet but would be fully treated with absorption panels/diffusors etc in the near future. I setup speakers with ears and with RoomEq software. 
Why not Merlins .. ??
I have thoroughly enjoyed Merlins but sometime feel it can sound a little thin and won't reach the lowest bass. Larger sound stage is desired. Full scale classical music can have better depth, width and weight. I have been using various versions of Merlins since 2009 and have the last version produced (Black magic) with dual BAMs. I have purchased two Funk Audio subwoofers that I have not integrated with the system yet. Merlin is not very subwoofer friendly anyways.
What I am looking for:
Ideal speakers would get from "Merlin" its neutral, resolving, transparent, low distortion, dynamic character. On top would also deliver fuller sound (top to bottom), be a full range down to 20Hz, provide bigger sound stage and has a more organic / relaxing sound (..better emotional connectivity). Speakers should be tube friendly, (preferably SET or OTL).
Brands:
There are simply too many out there. These brands come to mind: dynaudio, magico, sonus-faber, mbl, B&W, wilson audio, rockport, jm-labs, dunlavy, wilson benesch.  I am sure someone who has owned Merlins and made a move can give their input. Even a short list to audition would be helpful. I am based out of Orlando area. Would be great If any local member has a system that they can allow me to audition.
Past experience:
Other notable speakers I have owned in past include original Flocal Utopias (mezzo to grand Utopia), B&W nautilus series, Quad 989 among others. Yesterday's nautilus 800, 802 were power hungry and sounded boxy. This may not be the case with the newer models.  I feel like I am out of touch with what is out there. Have been out of market for long. 
Thanks.



celestial_audio
lprules1962
32 posts
 
I have the Merlin VSM for a long time - 7 years, in a smallish room, 11' x 15'. Once moved to a bigger, dedicated room with room treatments (14' x 18') the sound was not full enough, with or without subs (JL Fathom x 2).
The VSM are great sound speakers, but not without limitations, like others. For massive passage in classical music it could sound thin in bigger rooms.
Since then upgraded to the Silverline Bolero Supreme. They can play in bigger scale, bigger impact, but less transparency in the mid-range. But the sound stage expansion and more 3D presentation made it a true upgrade. And lot more bass too, and deeper, however not full range down to 20Hz.
Now upgraded to Egglestonworks Andra III SE (circa 2017). Better than the former two in every way, no drawback yet, besides placement which takes some time to optimize. Very happy.
P.S. Had Watt/Puppy 7s in between, not my cup of tea.
twoch
429 posts
 
Hi.  I own the BM merlin
 I find it is bright more so
Then i want them to be
  I was wondering what you were thinking about 
   I have the tube amp bobby sold. 
lprules1962
32 posts
 
@twoch  Depending on the room - in many occasions the Merlin default speaker setup will sound bright - reduce toe in of the speakers. Bobby said toe in so the tweeters crossed behind your head, work in some rooms but will sound bright in others.
Try toeing them out, a few degrees at a time.
Ag insider logo xs@2x
signaturesound
84 posts
 
 If the room is somewhat narrow leaving the VSM/TSM speakers somewhat close to the sidewall, toeing  them out can result in more reflected energy from the side wall which can make the mids sound more pushed (and staging would be hurt too).  So, instead of toeing the speakers out more,  told them in further so that the tweeter axis dresses in front of your face/listing position. 

 In my experience,  the VSM/Ars Sonum amplifiers combo has never sounded bright. But,  every room and system is different so this is certainly possible, though not probable IMO.  I have had customers who wanted a warmer more traditional tube like character  from the Filarmonia, and they have switched from the stock JJ E34L to other current production (new, not NOS) EL34’s and they are happy.

sorry for getting off topic. I certainly understand the VSMs are not the answer for everyone’s systems/needs. 

P.S. I have a customer using Devore Gibbons with the Filarmonia and soon a Gran Fila. Tells me the combo is great. The gent is a former Merlin owner

Cheers
Rich
trelja
3,224 posts
 
@signaturesound  Rich makes an excellent point in regard to the JJ E34L.

Although I consider them one of the best sounding current production EL34 variants, they definitely lean to the more forward and engaging side.  Their JJ EL34 come in more balanced, warmer, and even-handed.  If someone wanted to back things off a bit, that's a change that will get them moving in that direction.  The much overlooked Shuguang EL34B are also worth a listen.  For someone with a bit more to spend, Shuguang Black Treasure 6CA7-Z and vintage Mullard EL34 offer even better sound, without harshness.

I've had 2 pairs of Merlins, TSM and VSM.  Incredible speakers, and among the best overall.  Along with the Vandersteen 2, I can't think of another speaker that covers as many bases and listeners.  But no product is without weaknesses or suitable to the tastes and environments of all
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