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Absolute top tier DAC for standard res Redbook CD

Hi All.

Putting together a reference level system.
My Source is predominantly standard 16/44 played from a MacMini using iTunes and Amarra. Some of my music is purchased from iTunes and the rest is ripped from standard CD's.
For my tastes in music, my high def catalogues are still limited; so Redbook 16/44 will be my primary source for quite some time.

I'm not spending DCS or MSB money. But $15-20k retail is not out of the question.

Upsampling vs non-upsampling?
USB input vs SPDIF?

All opinions welcome.

And I know I need to hear them, but getting these ultra $$$ DAC's into your house for an audition ain't easy.

Looking for musical, emotional, engaging, accurate , with great dimension. Not looking for analytical and sterile.
mattnshilp
gdhal's avatar
gdhal
1,641 posts
 
....but the issue with Delta-Sigma is the filtering. The issue with R2R is this non-linearity.

@audioengr

Perhaps I’m "fanning the flames" here just a bit, nevertheless, I’d like to comment on this in particular because I was/am well aware (so I think) of the "filtering" long before I posted in this thred.

My Oppo UDP-205 (delta-sigma) has a user preference setting whereby the filter can be changed. Way back, I did some research as to what this entailed, and found it had all to do with "pre-ringing", "post-ringing" and basically everything at the 20 KHz point. I tried all (7) available filters and none made the sound "better" than the default (mini-phase fast). It only made it as good or worse, to my ears.

So, what "filter" is the issue with delta-sigma?

shadorne's avatar
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shadorne
7,477 posts
 
Per Steve’s last post above, this is exactly why hybrid ESS 9028 designs are way ahead of everything. 

The latest ESS designs are halfway between the R2R style and delta - sigma! The 9028 a 6 bit delta sigma by virtue of hundreds of 1 bit delta sigma on the chip!!!
audioengr
3,282 posts
 

jwm and charles1dad - I think the problem might be the system.  Each of you heard the same two DAC's, but in different systems.  It is very possible that one preamp or set of cables made one DAC sound better than the other and the opposite in the other system.

There is certainly expectations and listener preference, but I would suspect that it might be more the system effect.

Steve N.

Empirical Audio

audioengr
3,282 posts
 
My Oppo UDP-205 (delta-sigma) has a user preference setting whereby the filter can be changed. Way back, I did some research as to what this entailed, and found it had all to do with "pre-ringing", "post-ringing" and basically everything at the 20 KHz point. I tried all (7) available filters and none made the sound "better" than the default (mini-phase fast). It only made it as good or worse, to my ears.

So, what "filter" is the issue with delta-sigma?

Filter response, such as "apodizing filters" are not what I'm talking about. If you want to really improve Delta-Sigma filtering, you have to either eliminate the digital filter completely, replacing it with analog filters, or set the filter frequency much higher than most chips do automatically.  This effectively removes the effects from the audio range.  This is what I do in my DAC.  The user can select the 192 digital filter when playing back 44.1 files, and this is how most customers use it.

Steve N.

Empirical Audio

shadorne's avatar
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shadorne
7,477 posts
 
+1 on the filters - Benchmark overrides the ESS chip filters by ensuring the chip operates at 211KHz - even for Redbook - this mean the filters actually sit far above the audio (instead of close to the Nyquist ) and be extremely gentle such that they have minimal affect on the audio band (flattest response without the usual ripple)
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