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High End is Dead?

Browsing used audio sites such as Audiogon and the Marts, high end gear ads are dominated by several dealers. Non-dealer ads are usually people trying to push 15+ year old off-brand junk at 60-70% of MSRP (when they were new). They don't sell anything. You could slash Wilsons, Magicos, etc, 50% off retail and no one will buy them.

No one buys if it costs more than 1k. It's not that they're not interested -- the ads get plenty of views. It's that the asking prices are just way over the ability of buyers to pay. Fact is, if you see a high end piece for sale it's probably by a dealer, often times trying to push it at 15% off retail because its a trade in, but also often they are taking a good chunk off the price 30, 40 sometimes 50% off. They can be famous brands with a million positive reviews. No buyers.

Are we just poor, and that's all there is to it? 
madavid0
craigl59
307 posts
 
Schubert:
Or, the old quote, "The rich get richer and the poor get children..."
The trends noted here are the natural result of the cultural downturn in musical activities and the shift towards streaming -- where you can get anything immediately at no or low cost.
Who is going to spend huge amounts on a system in order to stream MP3 files? Well over 60% of current listeners stream only and this delights the small crowd controlling the process because they can ensure some revenue from each listen. But musicians lose.
High res MP3 (LOL) and MQA files might move this large crowd towards higher end audio equipment but there are a lot of unknowns. Who would have thought that Spotify would get the kind of stock opening it just received? As with Amazon and Google wonder if the big money has made its choice for the music streamer of the future.
bdp24's avatar
bdp24
9,788 posts
 

Being surrounded by other musicians my whole life, I was always alone in my hi-fi pursuits. Not only are they for some reason not particularly interested, they are also almost always far too poor to buy good hi-fi. The still-living ones I know now listen to CD's on their computers, not having a hi-fi of ANY sort. What disposable income they do have they spend on better (or more) instruments.

If you know any, you know they almost all have been supported, to one degree or another, by a girlfriend or wife their whole lives. Even semi-famous ones, who don't necessarily ever see much money. When Commander Cody was enjoying his only hit, "Hot Rod Lincoln", band guitarist Bill Kirchen complained that he was still making less than a Berkeley (where the band lived) garbage man.

When I met with Evan Johns the night before we began recording the Moontan album, he played on a boombox---his "hi-fi"---the demo tape of the songs we were to record. Not long after, his longtime girlfriend had finally had enough of him (he drank heavily, and could be "prickly"), and gave him the boot. He was semi-homeless until a disabled-musicians benefit organization gave him a room in their Austin Texas residence building, where he lived out his remaining years, finally dying last year at age 60 from liver failure.

I suppose the above has nothing to do with this thread, but I just was informed of yet another contemporary of mine dying, again of lung cancer. A lot of musicians start smoking (and drinking) at a young age. When you start playing in bars (even if you're 16, as was I), the free drinks make up for the low pay, and a cigarette sure goes well with a beer or whiskey.

efort
14 posts
 
I am in my mid 40's I have been into this since I was a kid and saw my neighbors dad's system. About ten years ago I was able to put together my dream system. And continue to upgrade as I can. When friends come over they don't get it. "That's worth how much?" They agree it sounds great, but they tell me how good their Snonos sounds. I do agree it seems like a dying hobby.  My teen age kids love their I pods Companies are pricing their gear out of reach. When I go to the shows I see and hear the new products but it seems tough to justify the $$$ to upgrade. Is there hope for the future generations to embrace this hobby and can they afford it?

craigl59
307 posts
 

Musical style also has an impact on high-end audio purchase. Classical music requires significantly higher audio quality to sound pleasurable than do most popular styles. SO, as classical style fades significantly out of our culture, there is less style-driven support for high-end equipment. When I put together my first audiophile quality system 10 or so years ago, I started listening more and more to classical feeds because on better systems they blow you away with the musician's skill and overall power of the ensemble.

This is akin to what has happened to piano sales. Most players today buy electronic instruments and few have ever played on a quality grand. So, like those who are not used to audiophile sound, they attribute little value to what they do not experience.

schubert
7,386 posts
 
Amen to all that craigl59 !
Few days ago I went to a Symphony Concert with a good friend of mine who is a Psych Prof at the U of MN . And a very prominent one at that .
Looking at all the white heads he threw me a line I had not heard .

"As the country gets dumber and dumber , fewer and fewer people read
books . People who don’t read books in the digital age have too short an attention span to listen to classical music ."
I said, and have bad taste as well !

Looking at this post, which has a lot of smarts from a lot of smart people leads me to say out loud what I have said under my breath for a long time .
People who don't go to live concerts of acoustic music on a REGULAR   basis , no amps allowed , have no reference in reality and  therefore have no idea what music really is . It's not a hobby for us , its a consuming passion .
In terms of streaming etc , music has become no different than any other commodity in that more and more is controlled by fewer and fewer . More than half of the phrases an average American utters were written by a marketer !
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