2. amps-preamps
  3. 136297-110229

Where do I go from here?

    • Marantz AV-7005, pre/pro (with balanced outputs and 1.4a HDMI);  Rotel RMB-1565, surrounds and center;  Rotel RKB-650, mains w/ bi-amping;  Martin Logan Motion 20, mains;  Martin Logan Motion 8 Center; Klipsch SW-10, sub;  KEF iQ-5, surrounds;  Klipsch RS-41 II, surround backs
    • Alright y'all, here is your chance to help out the newbie with your thoughts and opinions. Thanks in advance for what you may offer.  I have the above system, which is sounding really nice, with many of the qualities I've been looking for, but the upgraditis is creeping in, (again, sigh) and I am wondering which of the components may represent the weak link to my music listening nirvana?  As some my recognize, I recently added the Motion 20's to the lineup, much to my satisfaction, but where might I go from here.  I'm thinking my better half may let me get away with another $1500-2000 before I'm sleeping with the system and not her, LOL.  Since I'm more interested in the musicality of the system, listening to a mix of female vocal, rock, and dipping into the ambient realm now and then, I'm considering the replacement of the Rotel RKD-650 with something in a nice stereo configuration, possibly 3-channel to pick up the center. I'm really looking to broaden and deepen the soundstage as much as anything.  What do you think?
    128x128wisciman99
    auxinput
    2,920 posts
     
    sounds like the ML Motion series may be geared to be more of a "front row" perspective

    I suspect that this could be caused by the ribbon tweeters of the Motion. I feel that ribbon tweeters can be bright/forward sounding.  The same character occurs on the ribbon of the Monitor Audio Gold/Platinum series speakers.  It is just too much and too forceful in the highs for my taste.  They are just a little bit too hard edged for me.  The conventional tweeters of the Monitor Audio Silver sound more natural to me.  Just my personal taste.

    In this sense, the warmth of the Marantz 7005 could be beneficial here.  I would be careful of choosing the Hegel because they have very high resolution, but they can be a touch cold sounding, which might not be a good pairing with the forward sounding Motion speakers. 

    The Parasound Halo integrated is good, but keep in mind that it's just a A23 amp with a larger transformer.  It's not going to match the performance of the larger A21 amp.  I have read several comments that the smaller A23 amp is a poor performer in comparison to A21.

    auxinput
    2,920 posts
     
    the idea of merging an integrated or a preamp into a HT system is called a "hybrid system".  You would just take the left/right outputs of the Marantz processor and feed them into an input on the preamp or integrated.  It would essentially be a "preamp for a preamp".  Some preamps and integrateds have a HT mode or input which allows the sound to go through at full level (i.e. volume control doesn't affect anything).  If it doesn't have an HT input, then you would just have to set the preamp/integrated volume to a specific spot (such as 75%) whenever you do a movie.
    wisciman99's avatar
    wisciman99 OP
    75 posts
     
    Now I'm really confused, I thought the idea was to bypass the pre/pro of the Marantz entirely to get a cleaner signal.
    auxinput
    2,920 posts
     

    well, the idea is to use dedicated sources (such as a DAC or a turntable) connected directly to the preamp or integrated.  In this situation, the Marantz processor would be "just another source".  You would use the Marantz as the master preamp when doing movies that require 5 channel audio.  In this situation, the left/right outputs of the Marantz would connect to the left/right inputs of the integrated (or preamp + amp).  The preamp/integrated would act as a "pass through" audio connection.

    When listening to 2-channel audio, the Marantz would be completely shutdown.  The Integrated would be switched to another input, such as a dedicated DAC.  This would, theoretically, give you better sound quality because the goal would be to use a better preamp than what is in the Marantz.  In my humble opinion, I don't think the Marantz is really that bad because they use discrete HDAM analog circuits (instead of preamps).  I would also make the assumption that the preamp in the Marantz is better than the preamp in the Parasound Halo Integrated.  The Parasound integrated uses the same preamp circuit as the Parasound P5, which is based on op amps.  It's not bad, but there are definitely better preamps.

    soix
    9,454 posts
     
    @auxinput -- The tweeter wasn’t really the issue or stated as being more pronounced. In this case the entire soundstage presentation appeared more right in front and visceral -- much like sitting in the first row of a performance.

    @wisciman99 -- Auxinput addressed the basic connection above, but since you’re new to this I’ll add some more detail in case it’s still a little confusing. The new integrated would be hooked directly to your front L/R speakers and your highest quality stereo source would also be routed into any line input on the integrated (let’s call it the "CD" input) -- really just as if it was a standalone 2-channel setup. Now, to incorporate the HT/Marantz into the system, everything stays exactly the same as it is now on the prepro (don’t even change the channel balance levels) except the front L/R RCA preamp outs from the Marantz get routed to the "HT Bypass" input on the integrated. Believe it or not, that’s it -- you’re done. And here’s the best part --to listen to stereo choose the "CD" input on the integrated, and to watch TV/movies just hit "HT Bypass" on the integrated. That’s it. Pushing just one button completely and seamlessly switches between 2-channel and multichannel, and ONLY the integrated is in the system for stereo (the Marantz is completely out of the chain). Best of both worlds. Almost hard to believe, right? I and many others on this site have done this with great success.

    As for the Hegel (and I’d definitely choose the Hegel over the Halo Integrated), it really depends on your budget. The improvements in the 190 vs. the 160 seem to be more refinements than a complete overhaul from a sonic perspective, plus some added streaming/automation features that may or may not be important to you. Right now there’s an "as new" open box 160 available from a dealer for $1790 (maybe with full warranty) that I’d find pretty hard to pass up since you can probably sell it for little or no loss if for some reason you’re not thrilled with it. (If you’re interested in this I’d move quickly as it’ll likely go fast if it’s not gone already -- again, likely very little risk with this). The 190 is $2995 here, but whether it’s worth almost 70% more for the latest and greatest is up to you. Personally, I think you’ll be very happy if not thrilled with the improvements from the 160, so I’d do that and pocket the $1200 difference.

    Sorry to be so long winded, but hope it helps.

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