2. amps-preamps
  3. 126624-10101

My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!

So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.

Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.

Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?

Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.

 It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.

Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.

Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.

Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.

Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.

Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.

My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


128x128jays_audio_lab
viber6
2,448 posts
 
grey9hound,
Again, I don't dispute the factual statements you make.  Just acknowledge the factual statements I have made.  Of course, I don't know the level of detail and overall satisfaction you have with your system and music, because I haven't been to your home, and even if I were to come, I can't perceive what your brain perceives.  Will anyone be able to measure someone else's brain waves and then input it into their own brain to perceive it exactly the way someone else does?  I wonder if that problem will be solved in 500 years. But it is still true that despite your current satisfaction, YOU don't know what YOU are missing now.  Maybe that question is unimportant to you, because you are satisfied.  But there is more tube rolling that can always be done, and one day you will discover a tube you like better than what you now think is the best.  You may find that this new tube gives everything you presently like, but in an enhanced way, with more detail or whatever characteristic you may discover in the future but may not realize now.  Or you could acquire a better format of a favorite recording, and discover that there is more information and detail in the music that was previously unknown to you.  The possibilities as an experimental audiophile are endless.
grey9hound
1,112 posts
 
@ Viber6
.
Just STOP .STOP..STOP...PLEASE ?
Don’t put lipstick on a dead horse !
viber6
2,448 posts
 
mrdecibel,
It would be fruitful to discuss on another level why I think EQ is important.  I recall you saying that when you made recordings, you found the EQ helpful No component CREATES detail--the ideal is to reveal the detail that is present on the recording, and not obliterate it through distorted electronics, speakers, etc.  I think we agree on that. For that, your Luminous passive is just about the best.  But we should consider psychoacoustically how a listener perceives music and sound in general.  Suppose the choral conductor tells the male singers to belt it out louder than the female singers.  At that point, the female singers will be still singing their part at the same volume level, so the microphone will still pick up their sound just as detailed as before.  And the waveforms of the female higher freq will still be seen on the waveform of the complete music, but they will be more submerged and harder to tease out.  So the listener will perceive that the higher frequencies of the females are lessened and the enunciation of the female words will not be perceived as well.  The total information will still be there, but the HF will be perceived as lessened, with lessened detail at those freq.  There are many reviews of components where it is said that one item sounds more flesh and blood and the other item sounds more detailed but more skeletal.  We are all making the choice between these 2 types of sound with every component, whether it is a speaker, electronics, cable, etc.  Of course, nothing is pure skeletal and nothing is pure soft flesh, so every component falls within the spectrum between these 2 extremes.  The EQ is just a convenient way to offer different positions within this spectrum.  By the way, I have tried bypassing the Rane not by pressing the 2 bypass buttons, but by removing it completely and plugging the Benchmark DAC straight into the power amp, which would probably be comparable to using the Luminous between the DAC and power amp.  In this experiment, I noted a more transparent overall sound, but the higher freq and overall life were greatly reduced compared to using the EQ with my boosted HF settings at 10 Khz and above between the DAC and power amp.  (Of course, the filters are not sharp, so there is some boost down into the midrange.)  These were for modern recordings with full range freq, not musically wonderful old recordings.  Technically using no EQ would reveal more overall info, but psychoacoustically it is nowhere near as satisfying as hearing the relatively increased info in midrange to HF using the Rane.  All speakers have major deficiencies in trying to sound like the real thing, so I just use the EQ to get the speaker to have the tonal balance and thrilling clarity that I hear close up.  If I preferred a laid back tonal balance, I would adjust the EQ differently, or maybe not use it at all, and be happy to use the Luminous alone with the power amp.

Try the tone controls of your humble stock car radio system.  Set to flat, it is really bad.  Then increase the treble by just +1, and you will find that you hear more in the music and hear better enunciation of the announcer's voice.  The tonal balance won't disturb you much, if at all.  Then try increasing the treble to +2, all the way to +6.  At some point you will hate the skewed tonal balance, so maybe for you the optimum setting might be +2.  For me it is +6.  At +6, I can hear the obvious skewed balance, but I accept it in return for the much increased detail I hear.  The system is so dull and muddy without the treble boost so I find +6 is ideal.  If I then transplanted the electronics into my electrostatic speakers, I might find that +2 would be the optimum setting. 
viber6
2,448 posts
 
grey9hound,
I am sorry if you don’t find my latest comments to you useful. I will stop as long as you don’t mention it again. I was only responding to your latest re-statement of your position on that subject.

By the way, my best live jazz experience was at Preservation Hall in New Orleans in 2005 right before Katrina.  It was like a hollowed cave.  The small space was so live and exciting from the hard rocks instead of soft plushy material of most clubs and concert halls.  Just 2-3 benches for about 15 listeners.  The musicians and listeners were intimately connected.  It was just a few bucks for 30 min of music including requests.  People were lined up waiting to get in, for good reason.  Have you been there?  Where do you live?
mrdecibel
3,063 posts
 
viber, all your gibberish, although clear and understandable, says one thing that I have been saying all along. You are a unique individual, I am a unique individual, grey9hound is a unique individual, and that we all are unique individuals ( wc is learning to be a unique individual ), and that you need to STOP suggesting that everyone do as you do. We all want to help wc. Believe me when I tell you, when it comes to me, you have met your match ! It is immature, and it is godly, what you are doing. As a professional consultant for years, I never " pushed " anything on a listener or a buyer the way you do. I admire your experience both as a musician and an enthusiast, but I have to tell you that what spurs from your mouth is just too much. Let some of it go, take a deep breath, and ENJOY...…..Your passion is understood. Keep some of it to yourself. MrD. 
More to discover