The invention of measurements and perception

@kosst: "Unless you're telling me that those folks there can take their measurements and definitively tell the exact thoughts and feelings of a human being, you're not even close to understanding what I'm talking about."

You give an inch and they take a mile, so predictable.

Did I say that? Of course we can't (yet) quantify emotion, perception, thoughts, intentions...sheesh...

What I was trying to convey, and obviously failed, was to simply state that such emotions, perceptions, thoughts, intentions, etc., are all subjected to the same physical properties that govern the universe. We just don't have all the details (yet). Look, if we can imagine something, it can (eventually) be realized, simply because all thought follows the same mechanisms, forces, fields, enegetics, albeit in combinations that are highly, highly complex. The laws which govern the baryonic (observable) universe mandate it. The laws of thermodynamics shall not be trifled with.

Can we get back to measurements and perception please? Given that we have the same complement of cone cells in our retinas, the blue you see is the exact same blue I see.

stevecham
What I was trying to convey, and obviously failed, was to simply state that such emotions, perceptions, thoughts, intentions, etc., are all subjected to the same physical properties that govern the universe. We just don’t have all the details (yet). Look, if we can imagine something, it can (eventually) be realized, simply because all thought follows the same mechanisms, forces, fields, enegetics, albeit in combinations that are highly, highly complex. The laws which govern the baryonic (observable) universe mandate it. The laws of thermodynamics shall not be trifled with.

>>>>>Be that as it may, what is missing is the *subconscious* interaction of the brain with its surrounding, the evolutionary development of conscious and subconscious extrasensory perception and conscious mind over matter abilities. When you sitting there in your chair there’s a lot going in your brain - that is beyond your control - other than interpreting acoustic waves. This is why colors are important for (perceived) sound quality, and shapes, and books, and CDs and newspapers, as I’ve already pointed out.

The more CDs and or LPs and books one possesses the worse his sound will be. The irony is that those audiophiles who perceive themselves as High Enders can never enter the gates of Audio Nirvana. They dug a hole so deep they can never get out. But they get used to the sound. Modern neuroscience and physics is lagging behind what some audiophiles already know. I don’t reckon NASA or AES or MIT will be scrambling to study these audiophile ideas any time real soon so don’t hold your breath. People are so hung up on physics and electricity and the “science of hearing.” That’s so 1980s. Can’t see the Forest for the Trees.

kosst_amojan

What I mean by "what’s with you" is you repeatedly come at me out of pure ignorance, such as now, or you’re just inventing a circumstance out of thin air to reframe something I’ve said, like you did the last we met on the Tekton thread with your "one complaint" silliness.

I don’t know what you’re talking about. Frankly, you sound paranoid. Your claim that, "In the strictest scientific sense, there is no such thing as music, or sound, or color, or hot or cold," is absurd. Your notion that I suffer from "pure ignorance" for noting that is equally absurd.

You have acquired a cherished religious belief, which is fine. But your fervor is proselytizing it, and insisting that your faith is an Absolute Truth, is where you run into trouble with those who think for themselves.

Beware the audio guru.

These discussions remind me of analagous discussion in epistemology except the study of listening is much easier than the studying of reading because a music listener doesn't have to think about the worldviews of the composer, intended audience, and players, (but maybe do for the worldviews of the HiFi manufacturers and audio engineers - <i>pace</i> Benchmark DAC).I find @khosst_amojan's arguments closest to the worldview of pessimistic realism, itself a depressing subset of modernism which has been replaced by post-modernism precisely because it collapsed under the weight of its own contradictions. My own worldview identifies most clearly  with critical realism which does allow for currently unmeasurable differences in waveforms to be audible after a critical dialog and yes I can hear the difference power cables make even though those differences are currently unmeasurable. That said I've yet to see any serious attempt to verify the Shunyata thesis that the first few feet connected to the transformer change the behaviour of the transformer?

kosst_amojan"What exactly is the numeric value of blue? What is the quantifiable value of pain? What value is a D note? There aren’t any. The quantifiable values of the phenomenon have nothing to do with the actual experience. No part of our biology is counting wavelengths to determine blue or a D note, and those values don’t even come close to describing the experience of them. This is a widely accepted truth in neuroscience"

It is apparent, demonstrated, and obvious that this posting genius is a graduate of Cheech and Chong University and it is most likely that his introductory courses in electronics were instructed by Dr. Timothy Leary and as for " widely accepted truth in neuroscience" the genius offers no data, evidence, or reference for his claim, assertion or belief. Nevertheless he is authorized, allowed, and permitted to post his beliefs here and others are free to consider, accept, or reject his claims which should probably be considered under the influence of the type of substances I have thankfully always avoided and suggest, recommend, and encourage you to do the same as these claims show, demonstrate, and reveal the consequences of polluting your mind with mind altering substances that alter, cloud, and confuse the user's sense of facts, truth, and reality.