Hear my Cartridges....🎶

That was a great TV show. “Night Music” with host Dave Sanborn on saxophone and the sorely missed Hiram Bullock on guitar. Thanks for the clip.

I’m not sure “honest” (comparison) was the best choice of words in my post above and could be misconstrued. “Even playing field” is much better.

- 7f is fuller sounding
- 7f is slightly more “refined” sounding 

That's what I hear....🤗

For me, more so with the 7f and while both sound very good they both sound “dated”. 

Interesting Frogman. Can you please elaborate on what you mean by "dated"?

unless I’m mistaken, the first in which the tone arm and turntable are the same for both cartridges. 

Almost ALL the tests between MM cartridges are conducted on the same turntable with the same arm (DV-507/II).
And the test with the vintage SPU and the modern SPU are on the same turntable with same arm as is the test of the LDR and FR-7f and the LDR and TK-7LCa.
The DenonDL-103R and FR-6SE are also on the same turntable and arm as are the Sony XL-55 and SPU Silver Meister as are the Palladian and MIT-1 and also the FR-7fz vs the LDR.

Thanks again for the feedback and glad you enjoyed the "fun" with Screaming Jay Hawkins....😀

Right you are, and sorry about that.  Not quite sure why I wrote that other than the fact that I was always bothered by the comparisons in which the arms were not the same.  I understand that you chose the arms in which each cartridge performed best, but still not an even playing field to my way of thinking.  To be frank, most times I purposely chose to not pay too much attention to the arms or table used so as not to let any bias creep into my assessment and to simply concern myself with the sound.  I guess that in trying to avoid a bias I fell victim to one of a different kind 🤪

“Dated”:

These are some of my comments re FR in previous comparisons and should help explain what I meant by “dated”:

*** My main issue with the FR is the stereotypical criticism of early MC’s: the highs are unnaturally etched and hard. ***

*** the description that keeps coming up for me re the sound of the FR is “colored” in the way that some vintage gear is: a little bit of added thickness and darkness to romanticize the midrange, slightly rounded and generous bass range that is not as fully extended and slightly hard highs. ***

*** the FR sounds hard and borderline harsh in the highs while imposing a pervasive dark(ish) character to the mids. It seems to impart a tonal quality to the sound that reminds me a bit of a quality that I, correctly or not, associate with horn speakers. Strings sound steely and way too aggressive ***

Imo, excellent modern MC cartridges, the Palladian in particular and as heard in your comparisons are generally more refined sounding and offer better performance at the frequency extremes, the highs in particular.  They do a better job of conveying the natural timbres and texture of instruments without harshness.  

Thanks Frogman, for amplifying (😜) your use of the word "dated" relating in particular, to MC cartridges.....
It is here, where I believe we diverge significantly in our preferences and I believe you highlighted in an earlier Post, that your all-tube amplification system may be a factor...?
Looking through the MCs that you've had/have in your system....I can't see many/any that could really be called 'modern' designs so I'm curious as to which 'modern' MCs you refer to when you state...

Imo, excellent modern MC cartridges, are generally more refined sounding and offer better performance at the frequency extremes, the highs in particular.  They do a better job of conveying the natural timbres and texture of instruments without harshness.

My experience is quite the reverse....🤔 
I find the 'modern' Lyras (Helikon, Titan i, Atlas) to be either coloured (Helikon) or unlistenable, with etched and screeching highs, recessed mids and little depth or realism in my SS system.
I also, like you, had the VDH Grasshopper (aka Symphonic Line) which, whilst I preferred to the Titan i....shared many of its mid to high traits.
The Koetsu Urishi I found decidedly boring whilst the Clearaudio Concerto and Insider Gold were coloured 'warm' in direct contrast to the Lyras.
The Dynavector XV-1s was amongst the best (least flawed) of the 'modern' MCs in my system, but definitely added some tonal colouration to the presentation as well as having a monotonous 'signature' to everything played through it.
The ZYX UNIverse was perhaps the most 'neutral' and least offensive of all the 'modern' MCs I've heard in my system and I lived with it for 8 years (going through two with a third as backup).
It was only when I heard the 'old' LOMCs (and vintage MMs) from the 'Golden Age' of analogue...that I realised just what was missing from the ZYX 🧐
The Palladian, I agree.....is easily the best modern LOMC I've heard, but as I described, was designed by Dietrich Brakemeier with the 'sound' of the vintage FR-7f and 7fz in mind.

Like Chakster....I don't see any progress or innovation in cartridge design (MM or MC) over the last 30 years to warrant better performance at the frequency extremes. In fact, most printed FR charts which regularly came with the vintage cartridges...are similar of better than those which can be found for 'modern' ones and we've actually lost some technology (beryllium cantilevers) that we had in the past.

So what can account for our quite opposite 'general' views and preferences on cartridge design and sound...?
Obviously your tube-based system vs my SS one is a significant factor....but in the end, it has to be 'preferences' and individual 'hearing' differences that set us apart.
For instance...you often refer to the sound of 'horn' speakers in a somewhat derogative fashion whereas I like horns and the very best speakers I have heard are the AvantGarde Trios with triple-stacked Basshorns 🤯

It's commendable then, that faced with the difference in preferences between us...we are still able to have a meaningful dialogue on cartridge comparisons...🤝 

Halcro, I will offer some further thoughts day after tomorrow when I will have some time.