Why the fascination with subwoofers?

you CAN have bass that is accurate, detailed, smooth, natural and effortless with two subs, end of story.

Sure. That is why I qualified my comment: 

**If** you encounter a standing wave, it often cannot be fixed with only 2 subs. And it can't be fixed with room correction or room treatment.

(emphasis added; ***IF***)
If you *don't* have troubles with a standing wave then one or two subs can give excellent response.

The bass in "other parts" of the room aren't important particularly unless you curl up in the corner for a panic attack or some sort of modern dance move. I have a sloping high ceiling in my listening room, with one side opening up to a kitchen/dining area and the other side having large windows far enough away to make "first" reflections irrelevant, especially with horns that put the soundstage in front of me. In this arrangement my 2 subs work perfectly relative to the sound at the point where it matters...my pointy little head.

wolf_garcia:
"The bass in "other parts" of the room aren't important particularly unless you curl up in the corner for a panic attack or some sort of modern dance move."
Hello wolf,

    I agree that good bass response throughout the entire room is not important for many but it is for some such as myself. No, I don't curl up in the corner from my panic attacks or windup there from my very creative
modern dance moves..... at least as far as you know.

    It's important for me because I have 6 seating positions spread around my 23x16 ft living room that I use for both music and ht. Only one seat is in the sweet spot, precisely between my main speakers and directly facing a 65" plasma hdtv wall mounted between them. I have my dipole panel speakers positioned about 4' away from the front wall for optimum freq. response and imaging at the sweet spot seat. This works great for music at this seat but, of course, the stereo imaging effect is compromised at the other 5 seating positions along the left and right walls although the bass response is excellent at all seats.
      But music still sounds very good from these 5 other positions and, since all 5 have a clear view of the hdtv, it works very well for ht, too. The 5.4 surround experience (5 speakers and 4 dba subs) is very good from all 6 seats in the room. The bass response is outstanding, equally deep, detailed, powerful and dynamic from all seats with still very good mid-range/treble surround sound response and perception at the 5 non-sweet spot seats.
       With the volume goosed a bit on Blu-ray movies, the impressive bass impact can normally be relied upon to have at least 1 family member or guest jumping out of their seat at least once during any action movie at a bass intensive scene.


Tim

Dear @noble100  : HT and stero MUSIC reproduction room/systems needs are different.

Maybe that's why you are the only audiophile I know that can't be aware of the difference  using a high-pass filter in the stereo music main speakers and with out that filter even the wider frequency range in those bass drivers. Not only that but you said you preffers with out the high-pass filter because better bass quality performance.

Seems to me that or you are overall bass " oriented/biased " or for a stereo MUSIC your room/system bass has poor quality levels. Something is not " functioning " for a stereo MUSIC/sound listening experiences because the differences with that wider bass range in the main speakers drivers are not " subtle ". Something is wrong or was wrong when you tested about, it's impossible not to be aware of those " huge " differences for the better using the filter.

I can't be sure what is happening down there other what you posted in this thread.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

rauliruegas:
"Dear @noble100 : HT and stero MUSIC reproduction room/systems needs are different.

Maybe that’s why you are the only audiophile I know that can’t be aware of the difference using a high-pass filter in the stereo music main speakers and with out that filter even the wider frequency range in those bass drivers. Not only that but you said you preffers with out the high-pass filter because better bass quality performance."


Hello rauliruegas,

Why do you believe the reproduction requirements/needs of HT and stereo music are different?
I believe a single system that is able to reproduce the full 20-20,000 Hz frequency range accurately, with low distortion and proper dynamics is fully capable of reproducing both with high quality.
My combination stereo music and ht system is fully capable of reproducing the full range of audible frequencies with high accuracy, very low distortion and powerful dynamics and, therefore, performs with high overall quality for both stereo music and ht.
You also seem to have difficulty understanding why I didn’t notice a significant improvement in the performance of my Magnepan 2.7QRs main speakers when connected to the high pass filtered outputs on my sub amp rather than being run full range. I believe you need to understand the details of my system to understand why I prefer running my main speakers full range.
I built my system from the bass up because good bass response forms the solid foundation for most music and ht. Bass is also the most difficult portion of the frequency range to achieve high quality performance at in most home rooms due mainly to the extreme length of bass sound waves which are longer as the frequency decreases. For clarification, a 20 Hz deep bass full cycle soundwave is 56 feet long and a 20,000 Hz high treble full cycle soundwave is a fraction of an inch long.
The system solution I decided upon was to construct a separate high quality bass section for reproducing frequencies from 20-100 Hz, which is the frequency range of my 4 subs, and a separate high quality full range section for reproducing frequencies from 35-20,000 Hz, which is the frequency range of my main 2.7QR speakers, and blend the 2 sections together seamlessly by precise adjusting of the crossover frequency and relative volume settings of the bass section. I consider this system solution to have been a total success with the crossover set between 40 and 50 Hz and the sub amp relative volume set just under halfway at about 11 o’clock on the dial.
I’m not exactly sure why you notice such a big improvement in your system performance using hi-pass filtering while I don’t.
I use a crossover frequency of 40-50 Hz compared to your 80 Hz. Any sonic gains expected from the reduction on bass frequency amplification demands to above 40-50 Hz on my main speakers amps may not have been realized since my mono-block amps are not lacking in power with 1,200 watts into the speakers 4 ohm load, so there’s no lack of power from the bass to the treble. The sonic gains of your amps being relieved of bass amplification demands to above 80 Hz, however, seems to have been much better realized. Do you think more regular and reserve power being freed up for your speakers midrange and treble drivers could be the reason you notice improved performance in those frequencies?
Another possible explanation of why I don’t prefer using the hi-pass filters in my sub amp could be the Magnepan 2.7QR main speakers I use as mains. These are 3-way planar panels that have rather large 620 square inch bass sections which provide very high quality bass on their own but that lack deep bass impact and dynamics. Perhaps the improved bass response I noticed with running the mains full range is a result of the very high quality and articulate bass of my mains combined with the increased impact and dynamics provided by the AK Debra DBA system. I’m unsure of how well the bass quality of your ADS speakers run full range would combine with the increased impact and dynamics provided by your Velodyne subs. Perhaps you can try it sometime and find out.

Tim