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Hear my Cartridges....🎶

Many Forums have a 'Show your Turntables' Thread or 'Show your Cartridges' Thread but that's just 'eye-candy'.... These days, it's possible to see and HEAR your turntables/arms and cartridges via YouTube videos.
Peter Breuninger does it on his AV Showrooms Site and Michael Fremer does it with high-res digital files made from his analogue front ends.
Now Fremer claims that the 'sound' on his high-res digital files captures the complex, ephemeral nuances and differences that he hears directly from the analogue equipment in his room.
That may well be....when he plays it through the rest of his high-end setup 😎
But when I play his files through my humble iMac speakers or even worse.....my iPad speakers.....they sound no more convincing than the YouTube videos produced by Breuninger.
Of course YouTube videos struggle to capture 'soundstage' (side to side and front to back) and obviously can't reproduce the effects of the lowest octaves out of subwoofers.....but.....they can sometimes give a reasonably accurate IMPRESSION of the overall sound of a system.

With that in mind.....see if any of you can distinguish the differences between some of my vintage (and modern) cartridges.
VICTOR X1
This cartridge is the pinnacle of the Victor MM designs and has a Shibata stylus on a beryllium cantilever. Almost impossible to find these days with its original Victor stylus assembly but if you are lucky enough to do so.....be prepared to pay over US$1000.....🤪
VICTOR 4MD-X1
This cartridge is down the ladder from the X1 but still has a Shibata stylus (don't know if the cantilever is beryllium?)
This cartridge was designed for 4-Channel reproduction and so has a wide frequency response 10Hz-60KHz.
Easier to find than the X1 but a lot cheaper (I got this one for US$130).
AUDIO TECHNICA AT ML180 OCC
Top of the line MM cartridge from Audio Technica with Microline Stylus on Gold-Plated Boron Tube cantilever.
Expensive if you can find one....think US$1000.

I will be interested if people can hear any differences in these three vintage MM cartridges....
Then I might post some vintage MMs against vintage and MODERN LOMC cartridges.....🤗
128x128halcro
dover
2,250 posts
 
Halcro,
Probably yes. Just reinforcing the TT/Tonearm/Cartridge hierarchy. I still see many folk here putting expensive cartridges on cheap TT's & arms.
Having said that tonearm matching would be a critical part of selecting a $10k cartridge for me, even if it meant buying a new arm. I would want to buy a cartridge of that quality only if I could maximise its potential.

BTW I still have some reservations re the Palladian/SAEC combo - on the recording posted I feel the lower half of the piano register is a little vague and lacks incisiveness compared to the reproduction of the same piano above middle C. I would like to hear the Palladian on the FR ( I would assume Dieter has voiced this cartridge with this type of arm in mind ) and/or Cobra if at all possible with the same piece of music - I think that would be quite informative.


halcro's avatar
halcro OP
2,664 posts
 
Good idea Dover,
I'll mount it in the Copperhead and do a 'Shootout'....⚔️
We'll then see what's more important......Turntable or Tonearm 🎼🎹?
frogman
7,472 posts
 
Palladian:

Dover’s comment about the piano’s left hand is spot on. Sounds a little “cloudy” and indistinct in that register. This also causes the celli and bases to lack some definition and natural sound of rosin. Other than this issue the Palladian was my overall favorite; and by quite a bit. String and piano timbres were easily the most natural of the three cartridges and there was an ease to the rhythmic flow of the music that was very attractive and felt correct.

SPU Silver:

From the very first string entrance. Yikes! Didn’t like at all. Violins way too steely sounding; particularly when playing forte. However, there was much less difference in tonal character between the piano’s left and right hands. Much better weight and definition in this range. More saturated tonal colors even if rather “technicolor” overall. I find the overall sound to have an “in your face” quality with a rather strange tonal balance.
FR:
The worst tracker of the three with a constant sense of being on the verge of breakup. In spite of this I much prefer it to the SPU and in some ways it finds a (not quite) middle ground between the Palladian’s tonal naturalness and the SPU’s technicolor character. I find it a little heavy handed (no pun) and relentless rhythmically; whereas the Palladian sounds more relaxed and rhythmically coherent. I have to admit that when going to the Palladian from the FR, the Palladian sounds a bit bleached in the tonal color department and wish for a little more of the incisiveness that Dover mentions. However, overall the Palladian is the most refined and natural sounding.  It has the fewest distractions that tell us “this is not real”.

Thanks, Halcro.
thuchan
1,009 posts
 
Dear Halcro,

The Palladian was and still is the best LIVE Mc cart I do know, the Century is even more open, surrounding the listener. I do not know how they do it. I did describe it on AudioCirc, also the differences. There is still one Century to be sold, not mine!

best
E.
frogman
7,472 posts
 
And I thought, based on the sequence of posts, that Thuchan’s recommendation of the Century was directed at me ☺️ Silly me. $12,000 !!! C’mon, Halcro we need a shootout between the Century and the Palladian. Better still, between the Century and LDR 😉

Spelling correction to prior post: “bases” should, of course, be basses.  
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