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Dazed & Confused

Listening to mostly jazz, solo instruments and vocals I find my Martin Logan Spire hybrids to sound awesome, but recently I was listening to some both "Busy" 90’s rock and classical (lots of instruments playing loudly together) and I find the music starts to sound garbled and annoying (to bright), so much so, I turn it off.
I was wondering if you all might have some suggestions on some speakers that would be a little more forgiving with busy/loud music that I could possibly switch over to when listening to different types of music. That is unless I can find speakers that can handle all styles of music, then I would consider taking the hit ($$$) on selling the Spires.

Without getting into room size and dynamics, lets just call it a standard room, I was also looking for something more efficient. The Spires need a huge amount of power (and volume) to sound good. Looking more for something I can listen to loud but also still enjoy the music at a much lower volume if that’s at all possible. Neutral and not to bright.
Living in the sticks, I can’t just jump in the car to go demo speakers. Only once, in the past, did I purchase a set of speakers online and unheard, going solely on the sales person’s recommendations. I learned the hard way to never do that again!

Equipment now: Coda CSiB integrated amp with W4S 2v2 SE Dac running Roon Nucleus.

I also wanted to mention that the Spires have phenomenal base, so much so I sold the 2 subs I was originally using with them. Floor standers and bookshelfs have come along way in SQ these days, but if I need to purchase another set of subs the budget is starting to dwindle.

No vinyl or CD’s, just Tidal.

$3,000 - $5000 budget, new or newer demos.

Thanks for any suggestions or advice you may have to offer!
Paul
high-amp
almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
Hi Paul,

Happy New Year to you and yours as well.

Both the Maggies and your present speakers have the same nominal impedance, into which the reworked amp will be able to supply 300 watts.  All three Maggies have specified sensitivities that are 5 db less than the specified sensitivity of your present speakers.  The approximate maximum SPL at the listening position of 110 db that I calculated for your present speakers in my previous post did not take into account their powered woofers, which of course the Maggies don't have.

So it seems reasonable to me to simply subtract 5 db from the 110 db to derive an approximate estimate of the maximum SPL the revised amp would be able to generate with the Maggies at your listening position. 

And 105 db at the listening position is certainly enough for most of us.  Although I have a few classical symphonic recordings on labels such as Telarc, Sheffield Lab, and Reference Recordings which have been engineered with minimal or no dynamic compression, that can reach 100 to 105 db at my listening position on occasional brief dynamic peaks, while being listened to at average SPLs in the mid-70s.  But recordings having such wide dynamic range are rarely encountered.

Best regards,
-- Al
  
high-amp OP
508 posts
 
Thank you for your helpful and detailed response Al! How do you figure all this stuff out? I have a few other speakers in mind that I’d like to get the same answer on. If you can let me in on the secret I won’t bug you so much. Paul
almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
The calculations I do for this purpose involve logarithms, which I do using a scientific calculator. But a simpler method, which yields reasonably good results, would be to start with the following calculator. It applies to box-type dynamic speakers, and if the calculation is being performed for planar speakers such as Martin-Logans or Maggies that are listened to at typical distances (such as yours) add around 5 db or so to the results it provides. The reason being that as listening distance increases SPLs fall off more rapidly for box-type dynamic speakers than in the case of planar speakers. (And in fact the volume produced by a planar speaker may be greater at say 2 meters than at 1 meter, since the upper and lower parts of a planar speaker will generally be more on axis at 2 meters than at 1 meter).

https://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

Best regards,
-- Al

maplegrovemusic's avatar
maplegrovemusic
1,113 posts
 
high-amp - I am not sure where you are in your speaker search , but if you can listen to a pair of Audio Physic I would highly recommend them . I have been a stat user for many years now . I have owned the Martin Logan Vantage , Quad 2905 , King Sound King and Inneround kaya . and Eminent technology lf8 , Magnepan 20.1 1.6 1.7 . 

The high frequencies on the Audio Physic match the stats for there transparency in this region . Some how they image and sounstage in a similar way as well . They just disappear . 

Just a suggestion I would like to pass along as these have been the first boxed speakers that I have heard do this as good as stats . 
high-amp OP
508 posts
 
So I can tell I'm going to fail at this miserably as I was never any good at math. I purchased a USB mic thinking I was going to cure everything with the Room Correction Wizard and as soon as I opened the program, I was so overwhelmed I sent the mic back immediately!

I'm still trying to figure the efficiency ratings and frequency ranges of speakers and how all that works. Really, I just want good sound in a system that is matched up correctly. 

Thank you for sharing the HT website, I will see if I can figure it out, but I may be back to ask you your professional opinion again! (can I hire you?)

I will be keeping the CSib for some time now as it's in getting the current adjusted to the V1 configuration as well as a new set of caps as we speak (might as well get a full tune-up whilst in). I would like to follow up with some new speakers, probably something much more efficient, something I don't have to play so loud to enjoy.

Thank you too maplegrovemusic. I have heard good things about EP's as well, Is there a particular model you recommend?

I am thinking of starting a new thread about dilemma and see where that leads...Stay tuned. 


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