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Why do intelligent people deny audio differences?

In my years of audiophilia I have crossed swords with my brother many times regarding that which is real, and not real, in terms of differeces heard and imagined.
He holds a Masters Degree in Education, self taught himself regarding computers, enough to become the MIS Director for a school system, and early in life actually self taught himself to arrange music, from existing compositions, yet he denys that any differece exists in the 'sound' of cables--to clarify, he denies that anyone can hear a difference in an ABX comparison.
Recently I mentioned that I was considering buying a new Lexicon, when a friend told me about the Exemplar, a tube modified Dennon CD player of the highest repute, video wise, which is arguably one of the finest sounding players around.
When I told him of this, here was his response:
"Happily I have never heard a CD player with "grainy sound" and, you know me, I would never buy anything that I felt might be potentially degraded by or at least made unnecessarily complex and unreliable by adding tubes."

Here is the rub, when cd players frist came out, I owned a store, and was a vinyl devotee, as that's all there was, and he saw digital as the panacea for great change; "It is perfect, it's simply a perfect transfer, ones and zero's there is no margin for error," or words to that effect.
When I heard the first digital, I was appalled by its sterility and what "I" call 'grainy' sound. Think of the difference in cd now versus circa 1984. He, as you can read above resists the notion that this is a possibility.
We are at constant loggerheads as to what is real and imagined, regarding audio, with him on the 'if it hasn't been measured, there's no difference', side of the equation.
Of course I exaggerate, but just the other day he said, and this is virtually a quote, "Amplifiers above about a thousand dollars don't have ANY qualitative sound differences." Of course at the time I had Halcro sitting in my living room and was properly offended and indignant.
Sibling rivalry? That is the obvious here, but this really 'rubs my rhubarb', as Jack Nicholson said in Batman.
Unless I am delusional, there are gargantual differences, good and bad, in audio gear. Yet he steadfastly sticks to his 'touch it, taste it, feel it' dogma.
Am I losing it or is he just hard headed, (more than me)?
What, other than, "I only buy it for myself," is the answer to people like this? (OR maybe US, me and you other audio sickies out there who spend thousands on minute differences?
Let's hear both sides, and let the mud slinging begin!
lrsky
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
sense perception and intelligence, however its defined are independent of each other. the question shoule be rephrased to :

why do people deny audio differences ?

this question could also apply to other subjects.
lrsky OP
1,118 posts
 
I sincerely hope that all of you realize one thing...many years ago, I would admonish my customers at the retail level..."This is a singular hobby, don't expect your friends to begin to understand."
They'll come over, you'll be all excited about your new preamp, speakers, whatever--try to sit them down for a listen...you'll turn it on, and up louder for maximum effect...they'll sit there impatiently, squirming a bit, looking around, then blurt out, "That's nice, you got any beer?"
So, when I make these statements about my brother, it transcendends even my logic circuits--I know at the most basic level, the futility of anyone caring as much as I do.

Good listening,
Larry
tbg
5,263 posts
 
Lrsky, this is a problem with all passions. Were to collect Barbie Dolls, race catamarans, make modern furniture, climb mountains, etc. what you say would also be true.

Fortunately, the internet and cheap long distance telephone calls have allow us to find others with similar passions and to occasionally meet in assemblies that we call "shows." I live in a city of about 80,000 with an adjacent city of about 70,000 people. There has not been a dealer in audio for the 32 years that I have lived here. I know of no other audiophile here. But an audiophile friend is coming up on Saturday for a visit.

In the 1960s and 70s, even in a smaller city, there were three audio dealers and I had at least four local friends who were audiophiles. But there were only really four or five manufactures of audio equipment. No one knew of what was going on in Europe or Asia, and I was much younger and poorer. Life was great then and now!
lrsky OP
1,118 posts
 
Back to this 'old thread'.
I recently saw the movie, 'Hereafter', directed by Clint Eastwood, starring Matt Damon...I LOVED this movie, and the main theme, played thoughout, written by Eastwood, is a treasure. He has orchestra playing it, classical guitar, piano (think Eastwood played it)...it's haunting and beautiful. But THAT'S not the reason to write today.
Lush said...
"It still doesn't explain how no blind tests have yielded credible results in how we as listner's can perceive differences in an accurate setting."
There's a wonderful scene in the movie, in which Damon and Dallas Howard are taking a cooking class, and one 'exercise' is to taste food blindfolded...then tell what it is that they're tasting.
Overall, they were unable to tell what most items were.
I'm convinced that the 'Blindfold Test' that most people talk about...creates an 'angst'...some blocker, that causes most people freeze...to not be able to pereceive differences that one would normally think, are easily noticed.
I have NO scientific data to support this...but I had heard, before the movie of course, that under blindfold conditions, people don't perform within normal parameters...who knows...just thought it interesting.
Maybe someone out there DOES know.

Good listening.
Larry

By the way...I have a Book for sale on Amazon.com/Kindle it's a Political Action Thriller...called, "In Plain Sight"...it's a fast paced fun work...go check it out...$2.99--sorry for the commercial...but as a ten year poster here...maybe I've earned the right to plug this...I hope so!
tbg
5,263 posts
 
Lrsky, having several times participated in single and double blind experiments, I have no further interest in them. I could not hear which was the same versus different in 30 sec. listenings. Even one experiment long ago where we did longer listening sessions and knew preamps only as A, B, etc. and did our rankings, resulted in an improbable winner. I took one home afterwards and took it back a week later.

As you imply, such sessions are invalid indicators of what is good sounding in the long run. I don't have much respect for what reviewers report either as they don't work to maximize the component. Fortunately, I have an extensive network of audiophile friends who can hear. This is especially important as dealers have vanished.
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