Should people with no turntable or reel to reel be considered audiophiles?

This is how silly your overall position is, and even bringing Porschephile into the discussion. What exactly does that mean?

Its not silly at all. If you would just for one moment open your closed mind and consider, Porschephile and audiophile are very much related. Understanding one even helps you to understand the other.

Neither one is about anything as crass as stuff. Porschephile means literally love of Porsche- which by the way was a man, Ferdinand Porsche, who made the car and not the other way around. Ferdinand Porsche was an engineer who when he looked around for a car could not find the car he wanted. Practical, fast, efficient, durable, sporty. Above all he wanted a car that was enjoyable to drive. Couldn't find one. So he made one. He figured, and this is near word for word, that if he built the car he liked others might like it as well.  

You missed this the first time so let me lay it out for you nice and clear. This is exactly what high end audio is about. Ted, Keith, Eric, Peter, Krissy, all these different people making stuff sound the way they think it should sound. Just like Porsche. Not a one of them did a market study. They just made stuff they thought sounded good. People who care more about sound than anything else bought what they made. Just like people who care more about driving buy Porsche.

owning a Porsche and being a member of PCA mean anything other than you have the resources to buy a Porsche (and even then it does not always mean that). Nope.

Nope is right. Or else everyone with money would have one. Which they do not. Because way more people with money than love of driving. Logic. Try it some time.

 Does it mean you know anything about cars? No.

Right. Who said anything about cars? We're talking Porsche. Trying to change the subject. Weak. Lazy. Lame. 

Does it mean you are at all a superior driver? No

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Not if all you do is own one. PCA regions coast to coast do however have driver development programs run on a level second only to Bondurant, Barber, et al. In many cases they are the same instructors. Reality. Deal with it.

Does it mean you know how to handle a high performance vehicle at limit? No.

It does if you take DE and let myself or other PCA Driving Instructors help you learn.

Does it mean you know how to properly drive a car for maximum performance?

Yes. Something you would know if you had even one day as a Novice: all the same skills and techniques apply regardless of what you are driving.

Just means you could afford to purchase one.

My what a narrow, small, petty little view of the world you have. Divisive too. Porschephile and audiophile are united in their enthusiasm and love. Bet you didn't even see that one coming. 

Exclusion of people always sets up red flags to me. People who prefer Mp3 to Flac is where I draw the line. I have a friend who has 10s of 1000s of files and always prefers them as Mp3. We enjoy speaking about musical discoveries together but I find it difficult to listen to readily available files in the Mp3 format. If it's rare and only available in Mp3 of course I make allowances. I still enjoy vinyl but retired the Reel to Reel many years ago

Oh no Miller, I could see you coming a mile away, and you think your logic is perfect of course, but you can’t see the forest for the trees.


Porschephile means exactly lover of "Porsches", not the man who has long been dead, but the cars themselves. I must say Miller, you have outdone yourself. You write the line that should spell it out for you, but you miss the obvious conclusion perfectly:

Just like people who care more about driving buy Porsche.

For one, I know lots of people who buy Porsches not because they particularly "love" driving, but for the prestige. And even then, NO, not people who care more about driving, but people who care more about driving a particular way(perhaps) AND who ascribe to a certain brand. They don’t like driving any more than someone who buys a Kawasaki Ninga ZX-14, nor a GTR-Nismo, nor someone who soups up a Corvette, tunes a Civic Si, nor drives, a 4-wheel SUV set up for off road, nor someone who races 125cc/250cc shift carts, or even someone who just races stock cars at their local quarter mile. The Ninga driver is arguably far more focused on the ultimate in performance than any Porsche driver. That 4-wheel off-roader allows driving in conditions and places that a Porsche coupe would only have nightmares about. That guy who runs stock cars at his local track likely knows far more about cars and how to extract performance both from the mechanics of the vehicle and from driving than most "Porschephiles". That 250cc shift cart delivers a far more intense and raw driving experience than any road-going Porsche ever made, and for that matter almost any Porsche race car.

"Porschephile" means "Lover of Porsche". That communicate almost nothing about someones passion for driving. If anything, it says far more about a love of "driving equipment" than actual driving, and even then, only specific equipment.

And here you made my argument again. "Right. Who said anything about audio. We’re talking turntables. Trying to change the subject. Weak. Lazy. Lame.

Does it mean you know anything about cars? No.

Right. Who said anything about cars? We’re talking Porsche. Trying to change the subject. Weak. Lazy. Lame.

", Porschephile and audiophile are very much related. Understanding one even helps you to understand the other."

... which for some here is unfortunately true as you have proven .... it’s far more about the equipment than the music. You can’t possibly have good music if you don’t have THIS equipment.

Does it mean you know how to properly drive a car for maximum performance?

Yes. Something you would know if you had even one day as a Novice: all the same skills and techniques apply regardless of what you are driving.

Except most Porsche owners will never set foot on a race track, not even for Novice race school. The same would apply to most who identify themselves as Porschphiles. Probably 95% of people who go to racing school have never owned and never will own a Porsche. Does that make them any less lovers of driving or any less capable of driving well?

Yes, Miller, you have proven well how a narrow view of automobile "nirvana", is exactly the same as some people’s narrow view of audio nirvana. You probably didn’t expect that did you.

Careful there Miller, your Porsche bigotry is showing. Many many people who love driving don’t own Porsches, and owning a Porsche is not a requisite to love driving, or even to strive to some "ultimate" love of driving. You just keep proving my point without even realizing it.

Nope is right. Or else everyone with money would have one. Which they do not. Because way more people with money than love of driving. Logic. Try it some time.

And the point I was making, went right over your head Miller. As I noted, the crowd I was involved with would consider most of your "Porschephiles" to be posers, not real "driving" people, and some of them did own Porsches and a host of other sports cars, but also SUVs, and pickup trucks, and even a station wagon or two.

Thankyou  millercarbon, at least you were trying to stay on topic. 

The Love of,  philo from the greek

Though I think Mr. Robberdiditoverandover again is a rude person.

I think we could lock him/her in a room with no one else and they (all of his multiple personalities) would pick a fight with themselves.

Who wants to listen to a smart person that makes people feel bad?

You keep saying stuff, you know.. STUFF. Seem smart.. Wish you would understand, I'm not as witty. You know as smart as you..

Are you better than me? I hope so,  I'd like to meet someone better than me.. Lots and lots folks are... Are you better than me, too, did I meet another one?

I know a guy named robberdiditoverandover, he comes to my house to eat Chicken,shit , yea, I know, robertdiditoverandover, AGAIN.

Your rude.. But seem like a smart guy, just not to smart...

CD guys are audiophiler, too, a second yes..No ears required... Just the love of, that's it... SEE on topic... Can you learn.

Ops.. to long...suppose to be short, Thanks OP good question..

Regards

I don’t want to belong to any club that would accept me as one of its members.