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vinyl versus digital redux

Has anyone compared the sound of vinyl with the sound of digital converted from a vinyl intermediary ?

I am referring to 'rips' of vinyl made with high end, high quality vinyl playback systems, with
conversion to high resolution digital.
I find it nearly impossible to distinguish the two results.
The digital rip of a vinyl record sounds identical...or very nearly so...to direct playback of the vinyl.

If one has 'experienced' the foregoing, one might question why digital made without the intermediary of vinyl sounds so different from vinyl.   A detective story ?

We are talking about vinyl made by ADC (analog to digital conversion) of an amplified microphone signal and re-conversion to analog for output to the record cutting lathe, or from analog tape recording of an amplified microphone signal, and then....as above...via ADCl and back to analog for output to the cutting lathe.

Of course vinyl can be and is 'cut' (pressings made from 'stamper' copies the 'master' cut in lacquer) without digital intermediary.  Such practice is apparently uncommon, and ?? identified as such by the 'label' (production)

Has anyone compared vinyl and high resolution digital (downloads) albums offered by the same 'label' of the same performance ?  Granted, digital versus vinyl difference should diminish with higher digital resolution.   Sound waves are sine waves....air waves do not 'travel' in digital bits.    A digital signal cannot be more than an approximation of a sine wave, but a closer approximation as potential digital resolution (equating to bit depth times sampling frequency) increases.

If vinyl and digital well made from vinyl intermediary sound almost identical, and If vinyl and digital not made via vinyl intermediary sound quite different, what is the source of this difference ? 

Could it reside....I'll skip the sound processing stages (including RIAA equalization)...in the electro-mechanical process imparting the signal to the vinyl groove ?

Is there analogy with speaker cone material and the need for a degree of self-damping ?
Were self-damping not to some extent desirable, would not all speaker cones, from tweeter to sub-woofer, be made of materials where stiffness to weight ratio was of sole importance ?

Thanks for any comments.
seventies
cleeds
6,271 posts
 
orpheus10
In the beginning, hardware was made available to down-load LP’s to hard drive ...
Strictly speaking, you can’t "download" an LP to a hard drive. "Downloads" are for digital files and can be transferred at high speed. To get a digital file from an LP, the disc has to be played in real time, then run through an ADC on its way to a computer.
Eventually new computer cards came on line, and Benchmark made a new analog to digital converter (which they no longer make), also the audiophile computer cards are no longer available.
There are still plenty of high quality digital audio cards for computers, such as the Asus that records up to 24/192. Another option is an outboard ADC - of which there are many such as the Amari - or something like the M2Tech Joplin, which is an ADC that will apply RIAA eq in the digital domain. And of course there are still standalone digital recorders that include an ADC, such as the Denon DN-900R.
They said it couldn’t be done (we believers did it). They didn’t believe us, now it can’t be done because what’s needed to do it is no longer available due to lack of demand.
Nah, there’s still lotsa gear that can be used to digitize an LP. It’s just that - for the most part - people just don’t want to be bothered. After all, it is a tedious process. But it’s do-able.
orpheus10
8,668 posts
 

Cleeds, first I relax in the recliner that's in the sweet spot and listen for the needle to drop on the first LP that I've programmed on my play-list. Then I began to spiral into the holographic soundscape that's presented before me.

Since I don't have to jump up like a jack rabbit at the end of each LP, I wait for side 2 and get deeper into the music; the same music that's coming out is the same music that went in, including every nuance.

Each LP takes me deeper into the music, music that I've accumulated over many years and all the memories associated with that music.

In regard to the process, it's no more tedious than playing a record.
cleeds
6,271 posts
 
orpheus10
Cleeds, first I relax in the recliner that’s in the sweet spot and listen for the needle to drop on the first LP that I’ve programmed on my play-list. Then I began to spiral into the holographic soundscape that’s presented before me ... In regard to the process, it’s no more tedious than playing a record.
I think making a high quality digital file from LP is a very tedious process, and that’s why I don’t do it more often. But I can imagine that some people might enjoy the undertaking.
orpheus10
8,668 posts
 

It's quite similar to recording on a reel to reel; you have to make sure the level is not too high or too low; some records are hot (high level) while others are soft, so you have to make sure that's adjusted properly on each record, but it's as easy as recording to a reel.

In regard to setting up the programming, I have someone who has a degree in computer science to assist me, I must confess, I don't  really understand computers, but he does.
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
12,168 posts
 
What is wrong with electricity? If it were not for electricity we would not be having this conversation.
 I think you lightly dismiss digital storage. With digital storage backups are always a necessity.
:) My objection is having to use electricity to maintain the recording itself. Its nice that the recordings can sit on the shelf and sound the same ten years from now as they do now. Having worked for a while in the computer industry (albeit a long time ago) I do admit that I'm a bit distrustful of digital storage. But don't mistake that for being dismissive- I really appreciate the physical space and convenience. Digital has gotten good enough that if I had to start over, I'd probably not be so concerned about having vinyl. But OTOH have some LPs that simply won't ever get to be reissued from the masters as they are gone (ex.: Its A Beautiful Day famously burned the master tape to their best LP during a dispute with the label).
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