High end Class D amps?

YOU are not one of the best designers. You are not even a designer. I would highly doubt you are an engineer.

Rules that apply to linear amps, do not apply to Class-D. As well, how well feedback works is a matter of amount of feedback, loop gain, and gain bandwidth.

The "best" designers are few and far between and they say things like this as generalities AND to sell THEIR amplifiers. They also only say them about non-class D amplifiers.

It is NOT used just locally either, it is used locally or globally, and both. Both work. Depends what sound you are trying to achieve and what your design parameters are.

Most discrete linear audio amplifiers are really quite simple. You think your music was recorded through low, local only feedback amplification chains after the microphone? Get real.

It is not 1973 or 1974 any more and no one is talking about Kenwood, but your ideas and knowledge seem to come from 1974.

And yes, throwing speakers in the loop is exactly where this is all going. Subwoofers with position and velocity feedback are already here and research is moving this up the frequency spectrum.

George see's one graph, or reads one article and he thinks that automatically applies to everything with the same basic name. That is technical ignorance talking.

georgehifi7,965 posts12-02-2020 5:53pm
Problems with any amps shouldn’t be fixed by using even more feedback as a fix, it’s a added by the best designers to clean thing up a little and usually just local not global in an already well designed amp.

All the greatest amp designers say it. An amp should be reasonably good spec’d, and to use it just as a clean up tool.
And the preference with the best is to use "local feedback" only by the best designers. Not global as being talked about here, and then even including the Class-D output filter in the global loop, what next throw the speaker wire and the speaker in the loop as well, like Trio/Kenwood tried all those years ago, utter sterilized disaster sound.

And using tube buffers with the capacitor coupling that’s needed. Is just colorized HF coverup softening job for the more serious Class-D sound problem.

Cheers George

You have no idea and do nothing but put **** on anything that's not "pro" Class-D.
It still has problems sunshine, compared to the better linear amplifiers I and many other still say so.

You are nothing but a Class-D flag waver, that I believe probably has an commercial interest either now, soon or in the future with it.  

At the price points, or close, the best of Class-D is every bit competitive to the best of the other classes. Calling me a Class-D flag waver is funny. I am doing nothing but pointing out your ignorance on a topic you are very passionate about, but know little about.

At the level of performance of good Class-D (which does not need to be very expensive), you really are just talking about preferred flavor.

You continued posting of old, and wrong information seems to know no bounds. When you have to use ignorance or perhaps lies to make an argument, that tells a lot. Why do you do it?
The one who have proved repeatedly they have no idea is you.  Quick search shows you have been on this wrong-headed EPDR crusade for what, 2+ years, and still you don't understand it.  Ditto your class-D crusade with repeated postings of large phase-shift from an older technology Class-D amp. Ditto your insistence that Class-D must have phase-shift if the switching frequency is not MHz plus. Ditto your insistence that feedback must be bad (even though that is from a different architecture with different constraints). Ditto your insistence that doubling with reduction in ohms is essential to good sounds, without any consideration to what that means and why it normally does not matter, even with a low impedance load. Maybe you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

Maybe you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

That's more like you can't teach an old dog bad tricks, which is all your spruiking.

I will throw and old dog a bone ... namely I will throw you a bone George.

Explain, in detail please, exactly how EPDR impacts the ability of Class-D amplifiers to drive a load.

That is it, that is all you need to do.  I am 100% certain you can't do it correctly, but here I am, have the floor, grab the bone, and show everyone you are the expert.  Tell us exactly how EPDR impacts a Class-D amplifiers ability to drive a load.