2. amps-preamps
  3. 165160-107381

Options for integrateds for Ohm Walsh Tall 2000s?

Hi, all - back in the pairing game and would love to get some free advice from the experts on the 'Gon.  As we've entered our 'empty nest' stage, I've been able to spend more time pursuing my love of music -all types, from chamber music to classic jazz (female vocalists, Bill Evans, Ben Webster, Charlie Haden..) to acoustic to 70s Laurel Canyon to chamber pop, basically anything with melody.   That, and the fact that I don't just sit and listen with my head in a vise, led me to a used pair of Ohm MicroWalshTalls.   To me, they made music, not just sparkle, and were a good fit for our odd listening space where we moved around and lived  - open floor plan, 15x22x9 space for living/dining/kitchen - even while driven by a Marantz PM8004 with only 70/100W for power.  Redbook CD sounded great after 20 years with children and a lot of 'life' and noise at home. 

Not content to leave well enough alone, my inner audiophile started to emerge.  During the pandemic I listened more closely.  I started streaming hi-res with the Bluesound Node 2i. I realized that the MWTs couldn't fully fill the space, though they still sounded great with jazz and vocalists.   I started a conversation with Evan at Ohm Acoustics, like many of you have done.  He was great.  We talked about next steps, I sent him our floor plan, he helped me persuade my better half to approve upgrading to a Walsh Tall 2000 (couldn't get her to go for the 3000).  

So while our 2000s are being built, I need to figure out the replacement for the PM8004.  I've read all of the threads here, many on other forums, and I get what I've read but I'm still parsing all the info.  I have a standmount system in my study that satisfies my detail/accuracy listening needs, so I realize that this 'living space' system can remain musical and less technical and detailed.  I want music, not pristine sound.   My budget is limited - my better half supports my 'hobby' but wants to keep food on the table.  My budget is $800-$1500.  Lower is better.  I don't need a great phono preamp.  I don't need a DAC or streamer, I have the Bluesound and like it.  I want some more watts, high current and good damping, and balanced sound. I think these needs and wants translate into an integrated, gently used.  I've had great luck with used and I don't have access to audition locally or nearby.   

I've done a lot of on-line shopping and research.  Yes, I've subscribed to Zero Fidelity. I've considered the following, which have recently appeared in my price range: 
Class AB:
Yamaha A-S1000, 2000,1100.  Was minutes late for a 2000 on Agon. Have looked at an A-S701, not convinced. 
Marantz PM 14 or 15 series, not sure there's enough watts there.  PM 11 is a physical monster,
Anthem 225.
Parasound Halo integrated.  Lots of stuff I don't need.
Belles Soloist 1.  Missed that one by an hour or two.
I have a history and some fondness for NAD - my current c356BEE replaced a c326BEE, but not sure about the c375, c388, or M3. 
I'm a little nervous about Class D, but:
Rogue Sphinx.
Wyred4Sound STI 500.

What am I missing?  The watts of the W4S are appealing, but I really want a little warmth and musicality.  Will the 2000 provide that with Class D?  I would really appreciate the collective wisdom of those out there who have some experience with Ohms and pairings.    Thanks in advance for your thoughts!






mklinkma
reubent
7,051 posts
 
@mklinkma  - Sorry for the late response. I've been on vacation.....

Regarding the Rega - There is a Rega Elicit and a Rega Elicit-R. I've owned both. The Elicit-R is much better IMHO. It is also more expensive used, but worth the extra cost IMHO. Wish you had the ability to hear one in a decent system. I think you would be impressed.
mklinkma OP
8 posts
 
@reubent  - no problem, I've been out of touch, and the search is slow. 

I'm still just taking inventory of what 70-100W in the Marantz 8004 can do with different signal densities.   So far, my conclusions are that small ensembles (jazz quartets and string quartets) and acoustic pop are winners, orchestras and dense electricpop-rock not as much.  OK- not surprising.  But piano can be hit or miss, sometimes harsh- may be how it's recorded, or may be the current needed to handle dynamic piano passages.

At this point I believe I will need more power for the 2000s. There's been a lull in listings of integrateds I've been focusing on.    So - I ran across an integrated I had not really noticed, the Nuprime IDA-16.  In my price range, a unique approach to class D switching (pulse width modulation at high frequency), lots of power (200W), and a competent DAC (not so important to me).   It's hard to find solid information about the Nuprime, and I wondered whether any of you had experience with it.   Anyone?  

-m
reubent
7,051 posts
 
@mklinkma - I have not heard the Nuprime IDA-16, so I can't comment on the sound. However, The Absolute Sound review was positive. If you can get it a a price where you are comfortable, and can re-sell for little/no loss, give it a try.......
joekapahulu
251 posts
 
I have been happy with the 8005 into the Ohms. That said, I have also had the experience of a much more powerful, higher current amp and the speakers definitely responded. It was a borrowed amp and one that would cost 4-5x the 8005 (Mac 6800) but damn it sounded good. I also have listened to a few Class D amps including the Rogues. Not for me, I was more taken with the Rogue Cronus 2 although it was not tubey in my  mind. I am actually wondering about the 2 Belles Aria models including the new Signature. It is 2-3x the base Aria but I want to hear the difference. Im gonna be in NJ in September and that is part of the focus of my trip. I too like the idea of a US made amp that is built well, sounds good and backed up. I also want to get down to 1 box. I plan to try to compare the Belles, Mac, and some Marantz Reference as my 3 top list items. I am open to some other things but that is my going in position. I do have the caveat of looking at reliability as a high decision criteria simply because the absence of techs in Hawaii coupled with the cost of shipping means breakdowns quickly add up to an amount that can be 25% of the price of new gear. 
mklinkma OP
8 posts
 
Hi, all - 
Reviving this thread with an update.  After stalking HifiShark for a few weeks and continuing my self-education on affordable options, I took a left turn and bought a gently-used Peachtree Nova 220se.   I thought it would be a good opportunity to learn whether Class D worked for me while driving our current Mini Walshes and waiting for the new Walsh 2000s to be shipped.   

Why the Nova?  I was intrigued by IcePower, wanted to see for myself whether the preamp tube would soften the rough edges of Spotify streaming or was just a pretty blue glow on the faceplate, it had a headphone amp (not available with BelCanto/Nuprime), and the price made me less worried about making a mistake. 

First impressions?  Positive.  It's too early to dig deep, but...compared to the Marantz PM 8004...

Bass control and definition is notably better.  I didn't know the MiniWalshes had this much in them - and if I had changed amps before committing to the new 2000s, I might be satisfied with the Minis.  It's noticeable even on clean-source streaming, and at relatively low volume.  My better half noticed this within minutes.   

Complex musical passages are sorted and you can trace phrasing more clearly, also at low volumes....for example, those of you who know Steely Dan's pristine 80s recordings, the title track to Aja has some complex melodic and counterpoint threads that can get congested.  The Nova did a great job parsing them while remaining musical and pleasing.

I was surprised by how the Nova handled jazz and female vocals, as well.  This was one of the things I was most apprehensive about in Class D amplification.  But Diana Krall and Patricia Barber vocals were smooth while background instruments were clean and clear, especially bass.   Not fatiguing, just musical.  After listening analytically, I was able to just relax and get into the music.  

I'm listening to Spotify as I write this, and I realize that I am enjoying the stream without wincing at the compression and muffling that I had become used to.  It's still not as open as even redbook, but it is better - expect that may be the Peachtree DAC.  I can tell which selections on the Laurel Canyon stream were better mastered more easily than with the Marantz. 

It's too soon to tell whether my reactions are simply from hearing 220/350W vs 70/100W, whether the tube makes a difference with streaming, whether Class D will be more fatiguing or less natural as I listen to more of my most familiar music, and I still can't decide whether highs are more or less open and extended.   But it's a really good start.   

Did any of you have this type of surprise in moving from Class A/B to Class D?  Is it just the way that Ohms respond to power?   Would like ot hear your stories, too!    I'll post a little more after some more listening.  

-m
More to discover