Thoughts on Active/Passive Speakers? Looking for pros and cons.

mijostyn - This is fiesta75 or maybe there is a fiesta25 too. I've been active crossover bi-amping for a couple years longer, but that's not the point. Seriously, you should know by now that an active system is superior in ALL resects, that kinda why you are bi-amping. In this most recent post you indicate that your speakers are active, I understand that. They are plug & play, not really an active SYSTEM. You say the "brilliance controls" are what would get burned up incase of an amplifier failure, isn't adding a control or resistance after the amplifier outputs counterproductive? Is it a digital control? An active bi-amp system is with the crossover at the INPUT of the amplifiers and nothing but wire after the amplifier outputs. A passive bi-amp system is with the crossover after the amplifier OUTPUTS. Your system has active speakers, the crossover could be active or passive, correct? So which is it, do you know? It seems like you've been at this long enough to realize that a system with an active crossover sounds better than a passive one. PS. I totally agree that the best crossover is no crossover. 
andy2 - As for phase shift you understand the concept correctly, capacitors add a 180 degree phase shift. But when they are coupled with inductors and the variable impedances of drivers the entire "system" becomes unpredictable and only roughly stable. Phase shift will not remain constant with the changing frequencies. That's another reason that doing the crossover at the INPUTS of the amplifiers is better, so much more stable and predictable. I'm not wanting to argue, just trying to convince some people to try a "real" active bi-amp or better yet, tri-amp system that allows YOU to make some decisions on the sound outcome. Best to all.

@djones51 --

I prefer the former but I’m not a DIY guy and I don’t want to fry a speaker using the wrong parameters. I know some have used different amps and tweaked the settings for JBL M2’s but setting up actives with DSP crossovers is more than simply picking what amp you like and randomly plugging numbers in the control engine.

Indeed, there’s more to it than that - hardly a surprise. Cross-over/DSP settings and overall implementation is the real challenge, which you’d aid with a combination of thorough listening evaluations and measurements, fiddling with speaker placement, acoustic treatment and knowing full well the specs of the drivers/horns. This is a process that can last quite a long time, months even, and isn’t for the faint of heart. It is however a rewarding process of implementation; one you learn from and that can lead to great sonic results. Amp selection is really the easy part.

@mijostyn --

You are using passive loudspeakers.

Who are you addressing here? Be specific.

As long as the amps and crossovers are outboard the speakers are passive.

No. Whether the amps are placed in Japan, the active cross-over in Finland and your speakers rests on the floor in front of you in the US, if the filtration is done prior to amplification (and no passive XO’s are used in the speakers) your speakers are actively configured, period. Calling them active speakers, as per my earlier post, would in all practicality simply mean it’s simply a bundled solution. Active per definition is filtration done prior to amplification on signal level, be it a bundled or separate component solution.

If you think you can do better using an active crossover than the designer’s passive crossover you might be sadly mistaken.

My advocacy here is not really stripping passive, pre-fitted cross-overs from speakers and instead configure them actively - although you could, with an entrepreneurial spirit, and I’ve heard this being done in more than one instance with the active scenarios being the very clear winners - but it’s to tell people that active configuration isn’t just a pre-assembled all-in-one solution, but can as well be pursued as a DIY-option of separates. It’s what I do, and with care and attention the results can be (and are) great.

I have had no passive crossovers in my system since I got rid of the Divas around 2000.
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My Soundlabs are passive speakers ...

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djones, Using active crossovers is quite simple. You start with the same slopes and crossover points used in the passive crossover and if things sound fine you leave them there. The only danger you have to be aware of is trying to run a tweeter too low down and damaging it. It is difficult o harm a driver with too much power. It will distort like crazy before it blows.
It is underpowered amps clipping that blows drivers. You burn up the voice coils. In my case you burn up the brilliance controls:-)

Indeed, using an active cross-over (I use a digital XO from Xilica) is really quite simply once get the hang of it. No soldering on and off passive components and fiddling with values of caps, coils and resistors, but simply sitting in the listening position and doing adjustments on the fly. I was surprised how easily I got a quite manageable result within not too many minutes setting gain, cross-over, slopes and their types, and initial delay and Q-values (on some HF-notches). The real trickery on honing in more precisely on everything involved and learning often how less (than expected) is needed with regard to the changes in filter values to make a difference.

I would trust a mic more than my ears but I'm 65 so...

While nearly everyone in this hobby admits that the cable makes a difference everywhere it is used in the system, how is it that here, between amp and driver, it doesnt make any difference? Isnt that up there with all cable sounds the same and all amps sound the same? Isnt a passive crossover a whole bunch of cable PLUS a lot of other stuff in the audio path?

Brad

Nearly everyone but not all.