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My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!

So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.

Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.

Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?

Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.

 It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.

Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.

Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.

Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.

Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.

Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.

My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


128x128jays_audio_lab
jays_audio_lab's avatar
jays_audio_lab OP
5,381 posts
 
I’m not buying that stupidity.
I told a friend of mine behind closed doors that we are at the mercy of the streaming services. How can you ask a DAC to make you vodka or tequila if all you’re putting in it are grapes? It can’t...all it can do is make you wine that might be a little bitter or sweeter depending on the grapes but it’s STILL WINE.
The law of diminishing returns is huge with DACs probably even more than other components. 
Don't go out spending a zillion dollars on DACs. I own two of the best dacs so my opinion has a ton of weight. 
Find something balanced for your system and don't look back. Switching dacs is as stupid as trading in your car in each year for the same model over and over. Dumb move. 
rh67
307 posts
 
My 10 yr. old Lampazator DAC still to me sounds as good as anything i have heard in the 3-10k price range. Every year i try the so called latest and greatest within the price range given and not one DAC has sounded better.

I can afford to pay more than 10k but honestly can not justify paying more than 10k for a DAC.
jays_audio_lab's avatar
jays_audio_lab OP
5,381 posts
 
Don't blame ya. 
It is also very system dependent. The more revealing a system, the more you gotta step up your source. However, there is a cap that we reach if we are mainly streaming. That's what I want for people to keep in mind. 
chazzzy007
540 posts
 

This was close. To help with the comparison I downloaded song 1 on Qobuz to get a baseline reference. I also favorited Hanne Boel and saved her albums. Wonderful choice Jay or whoever recommended this song and artist. Well done!

My initial instincts after a number of a/b back and forth comparions is to check the box for DAC #2. In my mind this was fairly clear. The luscious tonality, coupled with a vivid, and bold presentation would win the day for DAC #2. As I was preparing to cast my vote I went back to listen to DAC #1 one final time… and decided to hold off. I pondered things and then thought about calling this song a draw. There are just too many things both DACs do well. So I went in for one final listen to both DACs.

The baseline Qobuz download was just too similar in many respects to DAC #2. On the original there is a thumping deep bass in the drums, as well as a very forward guitar ‘singing’ alongside Hanne Boel in ‘duo like’ manner. DAC #2 captures this in a manner superior to DAC #1 So once again I was ready to click the box for DAC #2 but before I cast my vote for DAC#2 I went to listen to DAC #1 once more to record some notes of it’s admirable performance. A loss albeit a close one to DAC #2.

To my ears the presentation for DAC #1 is just a bit more laid back. The drums and guitar that are quite forward and bold on DAC #2’s presentation are more recessed here. DAC #1 is different than the reference Qobuz presentation I hear thru my headphones as well. DAC #1 simply does not capture the guitar and bold deep bass of the drums like DAC #2. What is also different though are the the subtle guitar harmonics and decay I hear. How they gracefully linger and then subtly fade. Such beautifully presented music. That little ‘something’ that catches your attention as you hear something previously unnoticed is here. As I continue to listen, the drums though not as bold, also have a slight resonance as their overtones hang in the air for a moment or 2 before decaying. To my ears the air around each instrument as well as the vocals are also superior to DAC #2. When comparing this to DAC #2’s rich, vivid, bold sound I understand what made me want to vote for DAC #2. However to my ears that ever so slight ethereal quality just seems to be missing. That little something that takes a piece over the top into SOTA. At any level I think what we all look for is that missing 3-5% in performance that takes us to the next level and that’s when I decided to cast my vote for DAC #1 once again.

To my ears DAC #1 simply does the little things we want a top notch piece of gear in a system to do. Song #2 was a close but definitive victory for DAC #1. To my ears there is just that extra bit of air, decay, separation and because of these things an elegance and delicacy in it’s presentation that carries the day once again for DAC #1. And this in spite of DAC #2’s pleasing performance in other areas.

In closing this I wonder how the presentation of both DACs would change for the better with a more upscale amplifier? The Essence is good but not anywhere near the best in the Gryphon family. Therefore I will be petitioning Jay for a rematch thru the Evo Antileon once the dust and discussion on this shootout clears over the course of the next few weeks. Would either or both of these DACs performance better in the areas they are lacking?

Halfway thru the shootout the Scoreboard reads

DAC #1 1.5 points – DAC #2 0 points

viber6
2,444 posts
 
chazzzy,
Your changing preferences parallel my experience on this A/B project.  This is a difficult exercise.  There is a large price difference and we all want to make sure we come to reliable conclusions.  Yet the differences between dac's are surprisingly small.  That's why we are having trouble deciding and voting.

I have felt for decades that digital component differences are much smaller than analog component differences.  Phono cartridges are transducers like speakers, and their differences are as great as speakers.  Digital technology is more sophisticated, and even budget CD players are excellent whereas budget MM cartridges are really bad compared to MC cartridges.  

On balance, we seem to agree that demo 2 has a richer, bolder, more dynamic sound compared to demo 1.  If you evaluate drums with their predominantly dynamic bass tonality, demo 2 is definitely more true to life.  But for upper midrange/HF instruments, or in the drum case, the subtle brushes and taps of the snare drum or cymbals where HF are important, I feel that demo 1 is slightly more accurate and lifelike.  In a large space, spatiality is fully revealed with more HF presence, which I believe is more accurately done with demo 1.

Guitars and pianos can be confusing to evaluate.  In a small room, they sound big and more bass dominant, so if someone likes the sound of those instruments in a small room, then demo 2 would be preferable.  But in a larger space, these instruments are more HF dominant and show their sparkle and brilliance, so demo 1 would be preferable.

For me, demo 1 is still my choice.

Regarding better amps, I did post that in the comparative videos, the Antileon is more accurate and lean than the Essence stereo.  I suggested to Jay that the Antileon would be better for this A/B than the Essence, but I guess he was already deep into the preparations so he stuck with the Essence.  I also think that eliminating the Pandora would produce even greater clarity, so using each dac direct would show the demo 1 and 2 differences even better.  Each dac has its own volume control and preamp stage, so SPL's can be matched that way.  I don't see the value of superimposing two preamp stages with the added veiling.  For those who like the extra dynamics from preamp stages, the XLF is efficient and dynamic enough so extra preamp stages shouldn't be needed.
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