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Which Harbeths?

Trying to decide between the the M30.1/2 and the C7es3/XD. I’ve researched it a fair amount and I’m coming up a bid confused. Like most things it seems people have conflicting opinions. I’m coming from using various Totems for the last decade. I also just had a pair of Dynaudio special 40s for a short time before selling. I found the 40s were better at playing louder and had a bit softer top end, but overall just lacked that something special, ironically. What I’m really after is that just rightness I get with Totems. While I find there top end a bit much I’ve been willing to work with it because of the just rightness I personally get from them. My wife likes to say they sing which I think gets the just of it as well. Harbeth has sounded very attractive to me for a while and hope to find another version of a special speaker in them.  One that hopefully is a bit smoother in the presence and treble areas while also being very engaging and musical. I use a McIntosh mc302 and C46, so plenty of power for any of the Harbeths I’d think.  Anyways, I’d appreciate any feedback in these two models I can get. Anybody who has experience with both Harbeth and Toen I would have particular interest in your take. I live about 4 hours from any dealer and I don’t like to waste their time since I will inevitably buy used anyways.  
brylandgoodman
ryder
1,748 posts
 
Amplifier (and source/DAC if it’s not transparent enough).

Investigate the gear if you want to salvage the Harbeth. I’m not sure about the Mcintosh you have. Try other options such as Pass Labs, higher range LFD or Naim etc. Use open frame lightweight stands. Also, good suggestion to give the Harbeth some run in time. It will open up a bit more after few hours.

Totems are brighter and have higher energy in the treble so it will sound more lively and engaging although the amp and source have a warm or dark sound. The Harbeth will sound duller with the same components. I have tried the Totem Model 1 in my system before so I know who a Totem would sound.

Fwiw I ALWAYS change the amp when I get new speakers into the system. It’s a vicious cycle. The amp needs to match the speakers, that’s the first critical step. Further improvements with the source, accessories and cables can come later but the amp must come first. Just to share, when I bought the SHL5 about 15 years ago, I swapped 6 or 7 amp combinations within the first year to make the Harbeth work on the system. The Harbeth sounded like mud with the Plinius amp I owned during that time. The Naim NAC 202 / NAP 200 did it for me and the SHL5 stayed for 7 years before it was replaced with the SHL5+ which I currently own right now.


ryder
1,748 posts
 
If all else fails, the Harbeths are not for you then.
brylandgoodman OP
93 posts
 
I don’t think I’m really willing to play around with other amplifiers right now.  I’m really trying to find a pair of speakers that are clearly superior to what I have. Not just a bit better here and a bit worse there sort of thing. I’m realizing pretty fast that probably doesn’t exist, at least in my budget.  The Harbeths are great speakers and I much prefer them to most of what I’ve heard. I’ll keep listening but I don’t think I can justify the 2,000$ over the Totems.  I really think it’s easy to get the idea that if you keep throwing money at your system that it gets better and better. This hasn’t been my findings at all. I think the point of diminishing returns kicks in very hard around 1,000$, or even less when talking used. I am really starting to get fed up with reviewers and others who make it sound like things are much better than they are, or that whatever new product is some sort of revelation. I honestly believe after a good amount of listening that Harbeths midrange is no better that my little Totem Rainmakers.
motokokusanagi
189 posts
 
Ditch those Harbeths! Try different Totems, Grahams, ATC
brylandgoodman OP
93 posts
 
ATC along with Proac are at the top of my to try next list. Thinking about maybe the ATC scm11 instead of the 19 because I’ve read it’s a bit warmer. Although I don’t necessarily want to give up clarity for warmth. I really want warmth and clarity, and I don’t mean bright when I say clarity. When I say clarity I’m talking about a clean, smooth, and lacking distortion or any sign of crossover between the drivers.

 This is the place I find the Harbeths a little lacking perhaps. It seams almost that the crossover is one that slightly smears things in an attempt for smoothness. Which I would say it succeeds, it is very very smooth, but it doesn’t sound clean to me. I know many will say what I’m hearing is the difference between my bright Totems and the non bright Harbeths.  I feel confident that isn’t the case though. My C46 preamp has a eight band equalizer that allows me to play with frequency response considerably. I have turned down all treble on the Totems and I still get a cleaner clearer sound through them. As well, I try the opposite and turn up the treble on the Harbeths and again the Totems sound cleaner. I truly believe that Harbeth has a bit of veiling sound going on. This may or may not be due to the crossover, I’m simply speculating it may. 
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