Next best exponential DAC quality level?


I recently did a shoot out of three DACs using my Hint6 + routing each of the other DACs to analog input on the Hint6:

(1) Hint6: ESS Sabre32 -- Integrated 

(2) SMSL M500: ES9038PRO D/A   ~$400 

(3) Khadas ToneBoard(v1): ESS ES9038Q2M - ~$99

I played the same song passages on Amazon Music and was able to cycle through each Hint6 input corresponding to each DAC.

The result?  Very small difference in terms of rendering.  Maybe a more open sound stage with better overall balance using the Hint6 DAC.  The Khadas was more bass / midrange pronounced w/ a more narrow soundstage.  However, I wouldn't suggest that any were head-and-shoulders "better" over the others.  In fact, they were all pretty decent with only small nuances (certainly not worth the price differences.   

I decided to keep the Khadas for my small headphone listening area. 

But it got me thinking - how much would one have to spend to realize an exponential difference in quality?  Is the Khadas that good, or is DAC technology differences more nuanced than I originally thought (meaning, we're paying 10x for only 5% better).  

 

128x128martinman

I too recently purchased the Pontus II. That DAC made the most improvement on my system.

The Cornwall IV was driven by Audio Research LS2+Parasound A21 with Node 2i. The the Willsenton R8 in place of ARC LS2+A21. It was better in most way. Then the Muzishare X9 SET yields the most listening pleasure for the types of music I prefer, vocal, jazz, acoustic instrument and blue.

When the Pontus II inserted into the system, wow. You can read all the praises from established reviewers for details. All my family members commended how musical sounding, life like sound with the Pontus II.

Cindy is actually not wrong. Here is my opinion on the disconnect. 

What sounds good or best with DACs and other electronics is mostly art. Art IMO sounds better than transparency. That is why I don't buy products based on measurements. I don't care for accuracy products such as Benchmark, Genelec, Kii 3, etc.  

If you have $100 the Schiit Modi 3 DAC is transparent. There are less transparent DACs that cost much more of course, and IMO they DO sound better.

I like tubes, 2nd order harmonics, low feedback circuits, vinyl, and even some frequency response artistic voicing that is non-linear. 

For me, the goal of hifi is to make the original recording sound better and more life-like or believable in my room.

The goal for me is NOT to faithfully reproduce the sound as the artist and engineers intended. 

Cindyment I appreciate you bringing your perspective to the table. Most objectivists who come here are obnoxious trolls with bad social skills, but you are an exception! 

My profile name is my name, but my name is not Cindy ... if anyone cares :-) .... and thank you for the compliment @seanheis1 though you probably give my social skills a better rating than they deserve.

We don't have the ears, brain, sound system or listening room of the artist, or engineer, so trying to replicate that is a fools errand. I have implemented a system that is as "perfect" as I could make it, then I twist it all out of shape with DSP, often changing the processing based on genre, but also mood, target listening volume, even for a particular piece. If I didn't start with the former, I could never do the latter. My "journey" is no different from other audiophiles, I just took a different route to get there, and hopefully ended up with something more flexible along the way. I suspect what I have done is more the "future" of the industry.

 

We agree with the general consensus that there are minor differences between higher-quality DACs across a fairly extreme price range.  In fact, systems with too much complexity sometimes encounter issues that can deteriorate sound quality. 

We strongly believe that when properly applied Digital Signal Processing can provide a quantum leap in system performance.

For example, Dirac Live DSP processing corrects non-linearities in the entire system, including the DAC, cabling, power amplifier, speakers and the room effect on the audio.

So our conclusion is that a well integrated digital music source, digital signal processor, DAC and analog output section, when combined with Dirac will take you to the next level in resolution and realism. 
 

I recently had the opportunity to try out some of the budget DAC's in my system to see how they compared to my AN DAC5 Sp, which I consider to be an outstanding dac. The Dac 5 has had quite a few mods ( 768K Femtosecond input receiver ) as well as the AN silver oil caps and the super regs. I bought a Gustard x26 pro for my office system and had access to a D90 Topping w a linear supply.

Granted this was a HUGE spread in price and I felt the result was interesting.

Not to brag but my system is super high end and I have been financially blessed but the result is interesting and worth consideration.

Bottom line is both of the Sabre dac's sound very, very much alike in comparison to the DAC 5 and unfortunately are nowhere near the realm of the AN dac. I somewhat regret spending the bit more for the Gustard but it is much easier to hook cables to and is balanced like my system. I fed the Gustard in NOS and internal OS, 24/384 from HQ Player and 16/44 straight. I have 14 tb of mucic, mostly SACD rips and the SACD was where the Sabres began to show promise but never gave the holographic air and soundstage that the DAC 5 did.

PRAT was in a quantum league higher with the DAC 5.

Images are confined to the space between the speakers with the Sabre Dacs vs an immersive wide and deep stage on the AN.

The Gustard was the strongest bass but not really that defined, however on a bright system it may be the ticket.

The interesting thing was the 2 low priced dacs were extremely listenable and any flaws were just shortcomings vs objectionable flaws.