Speaker positioning and center image depth

bigtwin, I can understand what you have experienced but I think you (and others perhaps) may be missing the point about bringing the speakers out into the room. I'm using a equilateral set up with speakers about 9ft apart and 6ft from the wall behind them. I too have never been able to bring the front of the soundstage out into the room. It is always on the rear wall, BUT the difference as I experience it with most recordings is that the image begins at the rear wall and extends much further behind it. With the speakers closer to the wall this depth disappears substantially with the concurrent loss of resolution. 

And, as I said earlier if you want to hear what your system is really doing, soundstage wise, you need a recording in which the information is embedded. I referred to the Opus 3 recording called 'depth of image' for the obvious reason, but also because the recording is accompanied by the producers description of what you should hear from each cut on the disc. I've heard this recording on a great system and can tell you that it is all there. I've used this recording a a gold standard for setting up my system. I hate to admit this, but while I have worked hard for many years I've never fully achieved it fully. But hearing it initially, over a modest High End system properly set up, was an unforgettable revelation.  FWIW

My point was really revolving around how people attribute a speaker as one with a forward or deep soundstage, but in reality, those attributes have much to deal with how a speaker is set up vs the speaker itself.

First, I think this is a great post and point for discussion, so thanks for this.  Second, I usually don’t respond to any thread unless I’ve read every post, but I’m doing so here because I just don’t have the time so my apologies for my ignorance.  

While I totally agree that speaker setup, positioning, and room have a huge influence on how much depth or 3D imaging you’ll achieve, certain speakers just do it better.  For example, there was someone here recently who has Harbeths and rightly loves them, but he recently acquired a pair of Joseph Audio Perspectives and it was an “oh my God” experience in terms of 3D imaging and depth of soundstage.  I’ll add ProAc, Vandersteen, Usher, Totem, Avalon, Audio Physic, and Verity off the top of mind that just do the audio 3D thing extraordinarily well.  So, while I totally agree speaker setup/positioning is absolutely key, there are just some speakers, for whatever reason, do this thing better than others.  Just my humble opinion and experience FWIW.  Again, thanks for a great and thought-provoking post. 

Why don’t you hire someone to do a master set?  This allows you sit in more places so you can hear great sound from many locations.  You also cannot hear the location of left and right speaker.

There is a dealer in Denver who specializes in this and they demonstrate this in all their listening rooms.

You don’t need a dealer to do the master set speaker positioning process. I did mine on my own and the results were well worth the time. And it does take a lot of time and patience.

@soix, I agree - there are definitely speakers that can play big and/or deep compared to others, ones that are more holographic. Thank you for your sharing your appreciation on the post!

I would also add Borresen/Raidho, Quad and Magnepan to the list you started. Maggies are a particular speaker many boast of having a deep soundstage, but I’ve also heard them configured to project a forward soundstage. I’m able to do the same with my Borresen. Perhaps it might be that as long as a speaker performs and images well, it can be set up to have a deep or forward soundstage depending on how it is positioned?