New Dedicated Line - Almost No improvement


Hello,

Newbie here and electrical idiot. Just moved to a new to us house in Tampa. Before we moved in I had an electrician put in a dedicated line (has it's own breaker switch) which is 10 gauge and two Furutech GTX-D outlets - Rhodium.

When I hooked up the EMI meter in my old house, which didn't have a dedicated line, the reading was usually around 26 or so IIRC. At the new house the outlets are 89 usually and the dedicated line is usually around 82 - so not much help for the cost of the "project" and pretty noisy.

Also, when the ac /hvac is running the meter reads about 100 points higher (!) for both the regular outlets and the dedicated Furutechs. Not good.

Thoughts? Does the dedicated line need it's own breaker box? 

I'm also considering a line conditioner but wanted to see what could be done here. Thanks.

laynes

@laynes , I did not see anywhere where you indicated you have a specific noise issue that you hear?  I disagree with Steakster in terms of what electrical noise will sound like in an all analog system. Noise does not enter an all analog system and cause the issues that were described. If you are hearing nothing in silent passages with an all analog system, then you do not have a power issue. Power noise does not create distortion in an all analog system. It creates noise that is not correlated to the signal.

erik makes a good point. A dedicated line does not prevent noise that appears on your electrical box from getting to your equipment. All those items on their own dedicated lines, which is most of the high power are not helped by a dedicated line. They have benefit when to avoid items like dimmers.

I see many people suggesting multiple dedicated lines. This is more often than not a bad idea. The most important connection for a single piece of equipment is normally line and neutral. The most important connection when several pieces of equipment are hooked together is the ground connection. If you run multiple dedicated lines with separate grounds you have just made grounds loops worse.

You are running a tube integrated, so most of your connections are a single box. It is a good brand, likely with a well designed power supply. If you can't can't hear noise that appears to be power related when silent, then it is unlikely you have a power issue. If the AC is on, the sound noise of the AC is probably much worse than electrical noise.

I do not know what the obsession is with Rhodium in connectors. Audiophiles have some crazy ideas about how things work. If it was better, the military\aerospace would use it in all their connectors. I started out working on military\aerospace electronics. Rhodium is rarely used as a surface material. There are two properties you typically want in a connector interface material. Corrosion/oxidation properties are good, and it is malleable so that is maximizes the contact surface lowering resistance. Two other properties to consider are self lubrication (related to malleability) and wear resistance and impact resistance. You will notice I did not says electrical resistance. The coatings are so thin, 10-200um, that conductivity does not matter much. For any low power connection, gold is a great choice. High corrosion resistance, malleable, some self lubrication. For most power connections, silver is a good choice. Malleable, self lubricating, good corrosion resistance. Only concern is it oxidizes but that oxide is very thin and conductive. Connector wiping action removes typically. Palladium is the next used. It is corrosion resistant, but hard. The hardness in this case is a plus as it can be used when connector ends may be easily damaged. Alloys are also good in arcing conditions (anywhere you plug in live). Rhodium was used in one and only one application. Very rough service, i.e. field items where the contacts could be easily scratched/damaged. If I remember it was always plated on nickel, not for metal diffusion, but because it is brittle and could literally crack off.  There is nothing about a connection anywhere in audio where Rhodium makes sense.

I hope you fix your noise issue if you have it. Erik seems to be on a good low cost path.

 

We had our home built in Tampa and I could see the inexpensive electrical wire used.   Asked the builder about a dedicated line and had never done one and refered me to an electrician.  He asked if I was going to keep a large server needing dedicated power.  When I mentioned audio, he laughed and said to keep my money.  If you aren’t worried about voltage drop when the ac or refrigerator cycles, your at the mercy of the power grid.

OP make sure the sparky that did the work used a full space breaker, not a tandem breaker. You can Goggle that to see the difference, if you were out of empty spaces he or she may have had to us a tandem or split breaker in which case you could be tied partially to another circuit, best!

When I mentioned audio, he laughed and said to keep my money.  If you aren’t worried about voltage drop when the ac or refrigerator cycles, your at the mercy of the power grid.

Get a new electrician. As stated in this thread, there's more to it than the power grid. I guess he thinks it's ok to daisy-chain your audio system on the A/C and refrigerator line.

Wow, great replies – and even more varying opinions than I thought there would be. My hobby (although it is fading a bit I must admit) is racing my car and when I first started I had lots of questions and would get a similar amount of different replies. I’ll do now what I did then – read them all and consider them all, do more research and do what I think will apply the most to my situation and be the most beneficial with the budget at hand (that is unclear after spending a whole lot over the past 6 weeks on the new house) and limited time I have to listen - that is for another thread but hifi room is the living room and is open to the rest of the house and wife really doesn’t like loud anything or more importantly what she perceives to be loud. I’m looking forward to her finding her new hair salon, yoga studio etc. which is the only time I can go much above 70 db (if that) for any length of time. In the old house I had the basement and even though it wasn’t sound proofed well I could listen to music hours on end w/o issue. I told her I need to start home shopping for a second home nearby so I can listen to my stereo. Anyway….

 

Good point on the full space vs. tandem breaker (and I have no idea what those are but will google). The stereo took the last available breaker in the box so probably a tandem or split. This is a good time to learn more about this and will go down this road to see what the deal is. Thanks bikeboy.

 

Tennisdoc – Even though I had clean power in my old house it was inconsistent and we had brownouts often. I kept all of my electronics on these: https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FBK3QK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1 , which, on a youtube vid somewhere saw it had a clean sinewave, esp compared to other UPS’s. The (apparently worthless) EMI meter was only 2 points worse but did take some of the sparkle out of listening so I started unplugging all my gear (not much really) when I stopped a listening session and plug in when started back up the next day or so. Maybe there is a lesson there. Someone mentioned whole house battery back up in this thread (vs a generator which I had at the last house which I’m pretty sure was dirty power but also there was a 20 second delay) so I’ll also look at that but that power could be not-so-great also. hmmm.

 

Theaudioamp – good questions. I have done very little listening so far – mostly because of the wife-factor but also time – I haven’t had time to set up my cart yet so only have CDs. I have a Ruby K1 which I read is a good cd player but my vinyl blows away 90% of my CDs. I did just listen to Murder by Numbers (just found out this song was never released on vinyl) fairly loud so I could pay attention. I should have picked a different song or CD rather because there aren’t any extended quiet sections (silent passages). I’ll have to report back after I mount and align my cart and then will put on the Wall which has lots of quiet time. Right now I’m prepping the room as much as possible…doing what I can.

 

I didn’t search out the Rhodium – I just searched for outlets with good reviews. Maybe not so great but IIRC at $250 ea. I doubt I will be replacing them.

 

GHD – I’ll post some pics tomorrow in userID. Still have to unpack all of my records and cds (except a few), curtains just came today (not hung – 3 glass sliding doors on the front wall) and although I have a rug pad, I’m still waiting on the rug. After I get power straight (and maybe there isn’t much to do) I will start work on room treatment but also getting resistance from wife there also. Sigh. There is an echo, echo, echo here w/ an open floor plan and tile floors – and sliding glass doors.

 

I have read that more than a few people were able to plug their amps into their Puritan 156 so again with the 45 day trial period I think I may give it a shot.

 

I’ll do more research on what I have now in the breaker box/line and then will think about another line. As mentioned above the hifi outlets (2) were the last breaker anyway. However, the pool is getting a heater in a few months so that will have to go somewhere.

 

Sorry if I didn’t address everyone’s posts. I’ve read them all and will again – and again.