Audio Science Review = "The better the measurement, the better the sound" philosophy


"Audiophiles are Snobs"  Youtube features an idiot!  He states, with no equivocation,  that $5,000 and $10,000 speakers sound equally good and a $500 and $5,000 integrated amp sound equally good.  He is either deaf or a liar or both! 

There is a site filled with posters like him called Audio Science Review.  If a reasonable person posts, they immediately tear him down, using selected words and/or sentences from the reasonable poster as100% proof that the audiophile is dumb and stupid with his money. They also occasionally state that the high end audio equipment/cable/tweak sellers are criminals who commit fraud on the public.  They often state that if something scientifically measures better, then it sounds better.   They give no credence to unmeasurable sound factors like PRAT and Ambiance.   Some of the posters music choices range from rap to hip hop and anything pop oriented created in the past from 1995.  

Have any of audiogon (or any other reasonable audio forum site) posters encountered this horrible group of miscreants?  

fleschler

There is NO question that a device that measures better will sound more accurate(maybe not better depending on taste). The problem is we don't know how to measure audio products completely. We can do some measurements but the ones we do do not define a product. At minimum we need to do many measurements(and flatness and % distortion is far from sufficient) and also learn how to combine them for a final result. We can't do that now. The best we can do is identify measurements that are good clues and combine them with experienced listening however that's defined for each individual.

It is possible that some bad measurements can tell us that a product can't be accurate but we are miles from measurements totally defining accuracy. For what it's worth I am a measurements(and subjective person) and there are some measurements that I believe are good clues but they aren't the classical distortion and response ones. I recall my late friend Murray Zeligman who knew more about measurements than most  tell me the first thing he looked at for a speaker was the impedance curve because it was a big source of predicting speaker performance.

Receiving criticism for saying that no measurements can tell you if you will like the 'sound'.  Surely you buy hifi for how it sounds, that includes your preference. Tube amps always measure badly but many prefer how they sound. 

Hi my name's Dave and I have a degree in accounting and I have an expensive system cause I am rich. How dare those engineers who have spent their life learning about a topic I know almost nothing about tell me that what I believe is impossible!!  Well hey my name's Ralph and I am a musician and failed high school physics. I know how you feel. I know how things sound. How dare they tell me what I believe is impossible.

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I am not an engineer. When not one, not two, but every engineer who is not trying to sell me something tells me what I believe is not possible i have the humility to consider I am wrong. Not just consider, but will assume I am wrong till I prove otherwise.

 

That does not mean I lack creative thinking , or an open mind, or trust in myself, or a resolving enough system whatever that means. It means I have common sense and don't let my ego rule my behavior.

 

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@prof I appreciate your posts and views. Thank you.  @rtorchia similar.

 

@laoman  you twisted Amir's words over and over. It was poor behavior. If you got any snark you deserved it.  Many of you twisted Amir's word if not outright lied about what he said. I am embarrassed for the lot of you.

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Receiving criticism for saying that no measurements can tell you if you will like the 'sound'.  

 

@henry53 . The only thing that happened is some generalities were expressed about what people on average will prefer.  Many lies have been told about what was said.