Thiel Owners

jafant - at Bill's shop, he must be able to drive all kinds of loads with both unbalanced and balanced inputs. CJ experimented wide and long about adding balanced operation and chose to not go there. The unbalanced circuit simplicity won the musicality race even though balanced is 6dB quieter. True balanced requires twice the part count, and fudged balanced often disappoints. My experience reflects his observations. RCA cables often perform better than their XLR counterparts, unless there are pro conditions such as long runs, high EMF environments, lighting interference, etc. In livingroom hi fi we often have very manageable environments where single-ended RCA outperforms balanced XLR.

On my personal front, Bill is removing the input balancing circuitry from my Classé DR9s. It is op-amp based and of lower quality than the actual single-ended unbalanced input stage. We'll use the extra space for larger, better caps and a cleaner layout for what Bill promises to be decisively better results.

Regarding the 3.5 equalizer, the top version will actually have two complete circuit boards with one running positive and the other inverted, requiring an EQ for each channel - powered by an outboard power supply big enough to power both channels. That fully balanced performance will be better than unbalanced RCA, but at double the component count and cost. In the case of a real balanced preamp and poweramp (such as Benchmark), the true-balanced EQ will maintain balanced topology throughout.

I didn't ask, but I bet Bill has CJ at home.

tomthiel

You never cease to amaze me. Thank you for the history lesson on CJ. Their offerings are very fine in the RCA input/output tradition.  I have never been disappointed in any demo.  I can attest to the entry level models and top of the line models equally. Further, the CAV 45 is a very sweet integrated amp. While not the last word in a Powerhouse, it is musical and simple as hell.

Glad you are having fun with revamping the 3.5 Eq and speaker. Many will benefit when the upgrade is released.  Same for fans and owners of the 2.2 and 2.4 models. Good fortune are entow. And yes, the 2.4 is plentiful in the secondary market place. Quick decision and timing are important in landing a pair.

Happy Listening!

@tomthiel, wouldn’t separate power supplies for each balanced 3.5 eq be advantageous?

oblgny

I am already excited about your next home, room and stereo system. Although I am certain that every detail is mapped out. It is good to have you back here on the thread.

Happy Listening!

Yes, separate power supplies would be better. In all design undertakings a significant piece of the art is cost-effectiveness. Bill and I discussed various solutions and agreed that a more robust supply with various isolation techniques increases the advantages to both channels more so than the isolation effects of two separate supplies per se. Of course, that's considering cost. Since the supply will be separate, two could be purchased and assigned to separate channels. One of these days you could report on the relative value of such a choice.

More generally, my goal is to find the next plateau on the value curve, optimized at  higher level(s) of performance that stock Thiel. Those levels / plateaus will settle over time. I already know that Jim Williams' first level upgrade, coupled with simply moving the stock crossover from behind the woofer to the cabinet bottom - are transformative. That will not be a product. The first product will use the same Vifa woofer and its alignment, but a different (post 3.6) midrange and tweeter with better XO components.