Powered speakers show audiophiles are confused

In a thread on active speakers kota1 shares he is an advocate of active speakers, uses active speakers, and posts his system and pics of active speakers.

@thespeakerdude , who has nothing posted about his system is not impressed.

Like, who could have seen that coming? 

@donavabdear wrote:

As far as dynamic correctness, hard to answer that i don’t think there is any speaker that can reproduce thunder or a real symphony because no microphone can record it, even our ears don’t treat dynamics as opposed to transients in the same way. [...] Real dynamics, impossible.

By that token every aspect of sound reproduction, as something that aspires to a live acoustic or even amplified event, could be shrugged off as "impossible," and yet here we are with each our priorities and you and @thespeakerdude conveniently sidestepping dynamics because it’s a bad business model working from an uninhibited size factor.

It’s damn semantics; if by "dynamic correctness" you hold that achieving such is impossible in reproduced form, you fail to realize that some speaker implementations are way more dynamically capable than others, to a degree that makes a very worthwhile difference - even without meeting the "real thing." How about emulating the Apollo missions’ Saturn V lift-offs (from safety distance) in your home - good luck indeed - but those Genelec’s and other small toy monitors would crack open trying, while other more efficient, properly sized horn-loaded/horn hybrid iterations would actually give you a sensation of what it would’ve felt like. Just as an example.

Going after more lifelike dynamics is absolutely worth it for those who aren’t restricted by size demands or otherwise simply wills it as a factor to pursue. The consumer can actually go with whatever speaker scenario one chooses, and accommodate accordingly.

@thespeakerdude wrote:

Dynamic correctness, dynamic excitement seem to be implying the same thing. How long can you play, and what effects of any concerning dynamic compression. Horn loading / compression drivers is not the only way to achieve this of course. Horns provide, properly designed, constant directivity, but using a standard woofer/mif-woofer and a wave guide tweeter provides similar benefits without the side effects of vertical directivity lobing which can cause unpleasant reflections off vertical surfaces, likely one of the reasons why some people "don’t like horns".

"Vertical directivity lobing" isn’t an argument against proper horn-loaded compression driver-fitted speakers that wouldn’t potentially befit a low eff. waveguide + tweeter solution. Dynamically however a standard, low eff. woofer/mids + dome tweeter on a waveguide certainly falls short by a mile compared to a high eff. pro woofer/mid and compression driver + horn combo - it’s no comparison, really, also as something that matters and is perceivable in a domestic setting.

I think we can agree that a real horn loaded speaker at 20Hz, even a tapped horn is rather enormous and outside the realistic realm for most people. To achieve true directivity at the frequency is just unrealistic and you are not going to avoid room modes. Velocity/position feedback eliminates power compression issues in subs, and cheap efficient amplification is plentiful. Just put in a bunch of power subs and be done with it.

We can agree re: size factor of horn-loaded subs @20Hz, yes, but that’s not to say it isn’t doable if one so chooses. 20cf. per cab is sizeable, but once tucked away in corners they actually stay there.

What you don’t do, categorically, is bend the laws of physics with small sub size wanting to maintain extension, but in multiples they can ameliorate some of the weaknesses here. You work from a limitedly sized physical package, I and others around here don’t, and don’t tell it doesn’t matter. You know it does (and if you don’t you haven’t heard the difference or just don’t care), but as a MFR you try and downplay the significance as it suits your case.

And to be clear: you don’t eliminate power compression as proposed. There’s only one way around that, and that should be clear by now.

@phusis +1

Thought you would like this video of a "dynamic" system 😲 (Make sure to check out the sub at the 23:00 mark)

@kota1 the topic of the thread is "Powered speakers show audiophiles are confused", not does @thespeakerdude have a nice system. I have talked extensively about the technical details and underpinnings of active speakers. I can and do that all day off the top of my head. Have you posted anything relevant in regards to active speakers, how they work, why they can do what they do, why they will only get better, what technology underpins those advancement? No you have not. So how about you stick to the topic, and stop trying to make yourself look better at my expense.

@phusis,

Have you been following what I said I do?  Speakers for professional applications? Do you think that just means studio speakers?  @donavabdear mixes for movies where you are trying to "recreate" real dynamic events.

20CuFt is not really enough for a proper horn loading at 20Hz.

Tell me @phusis, what is your personal definition of "dynamics"? 
What is a sufficient peak db level?

What is a peak db level listening to an orchestra say 10 rows from the stage?

How often are you trying to recreate a Saturn V launch?