You have misconstrued what I am suggesting. I am suggesting keeping the headshell offset at 0 ( straight ) move the arm mounting point forward in order to set 2 null points. The 2 null points could be anything, for example 1/3 & 2/3 across the record. The 7 inch arm is probably not possible, but certainly the longer ones could be set up this way. My gut feel is that the straight headshell has more impact than the "underhung" geometry. With the "underhung" claimed by VIV I don't get it. If you look at their set up template their null point is in the middle of the record playing area, which means that irrespective of the "underhung" set up, skating forces are going positive and negative as the cartridge tracks across the record. If they set the null at the end of the record, then the skating forces would always be in 1 direction only, and therefore much easier to control. |
@cleeds You Stated, "Unfortunately, there are some users here who very much treat discussions as a battle where the adversary must be annihilated. They make absolute pronouncements, and then attack any person or product that conflicts with their personal gospel. It stifles conversation." @neonknight has created another Thread seeking ideas about Tonearm Alternatives for a owned model. 'neonknight', as an extension of the earlier started Thread and I assume as a result of looking into the world of Tonearms. Has most likely made a discovery that got his attention. The want has been expressed to learn a little more, resulting in creating this Thread, where there is a inquiry about the Viv Lab Tonearm, resulting in the following: "I am trying to do my due diligence about this arm. I am just having a hard time getting my head around this idea of zero overhang and no offset. Does this arm really work the way it is reported to do?" Six Pages have followed, where it can be seen, reports offered by users of the Viv Lab Arm, have been denied the validity being made known about their experiences and the Good Impression made. Viv Lab Arm Users have even made it known that they have had it supersede other Brand Tonearms that show up regularly as a Tonearm to aspire to, or seen as a recommendation to others to seriously consider. The Thread has a healthy motivation, as it has certainly been with a content supplied through the positive information, through the reporting on user experiences, that has encouraged other to investigate further and in some cases create the chance to experience the design or a close alternative when possible. Hoo Rah for that as a outcome, nothing ventured , nothing gained. Certainly no noticeable 'contempt prior to investigation' from this group of inquisitive types. The most noticeable alternative approach to the Thread from the above two outlined approaches, are looking to be from individuals that have completely misunderstood the Op's inquiry. These individuals have approached the Thread to do the utmost best to impose their interpretations on why a Overhung Geometry is the only configuration worthwhile considering and why the Underhung Geometry is not worth any consideration. It is this approach that is seemingly way 'off track', pardon the pun, and quite a distance from the OP's initial inquiry. As a basic evaluation, the OP, has still got an interest in the Viv Lab Arm and has made inroads to learning how to acquire one. Users of the Viv Lab Arm, do not appear through their reporting, to be swayed to making a change to an alternative arm. A few very experienced users of the Vinyl Medium have and are to actively create an experience of the Geometry of the Viv Lab Arm. This is where I connect with the Thread. A 'minority' are left licking their wounds to fight another day, 'there is certainly no winners in this camp' the arguments presented are off topic. Looking at the follow up the the posts made from this camp, it does look like the content has been dismissed as being, not of any use by many readers of it.
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The combo of properly set offset + overhang is the only way to get the 2 null points. If you eliminate either one of those aspects you can only achieve a single null. This single null still requires proper setup to achieve it.
I am starting to believe the effects skating force are painted with much too wide of a brush. One only needs to set a traditional arm with no antiskate on a blank record and note the speed at which it flies to the center. Now take an underhung arm without offset on the same record and in theory the skating forces should identify the location of the single null. This will not be immediate and will take several seconds. The thing that is interesting about this is while both setups do have skating forces involved, the magnitudes of the two are vastly different. One could argue that the application of 'proper' antiskate to an offset arm will result in forces similar to that of the underhung arm but then we have to consider how modulation level comes into play and the need for a big brush to cover up the reality hiding in the cracks becomes clear. dave |
Would love to get Peter Lederman @retipper (SoundSmith) take on this. |
