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Is Imaging Worth Chasing?

Man, am I going to be torn apart for this. But I says what I says and I mean what I says.

Here’s a long term trend I’ve noticed in the audio press. Specs that used to be front and center in equipment reviews have essentially disappeared. Total harmonic distortion, for instance. Twenty years ago, THD was the start and end of the evaluation of any amplifier. Well, maybe power, first. Then THD. Armed with those two numbers, shopping was safe and easy.

The explanation for the disappearance is not hard to figure. Designers got so good in those categories that the numbers became meaningless. Today, most every amp on the shelf has disappearingly low distortion. Comparing .00001 to .000001 is a fool’s errand and both the writers and the readers know it. Power got cheap, even before Class D came along to make it even cheaper. Anyone who tries bragging about his 100 watts will be laughed out of the audio club.

Stereophile still needed to fill it’s pages and audiophiles still needed things to argue about so, into the void, stepped imaging. Reviewers go on and on about imaging. And within the umbrella of imaging, they write separately about the images height, width, and depth. “I closed my eyes and I could see a rock solid picture of the violas behind the violins.” “The soundstage extended far beyond the width of the speakers.” And on and on.

Now, most everyone who will read this knows more about audio equipment than me. But I know music. I know how to listen. And the number of times that I’ve seen imaging, that I’ve seen an imaginary soundstage before me, can be counted on my fingers. Maybe the fingers of one hand.

My speakers are 5-6 feet apart. I don’t have a listening chair qua listening chair but I’m usually 8-9 feet back. (This configuration is driven by many variables but sound quality is probably third on the list.) Not a terrible set-up, is my guess from reading lots of speaker placement articles. And God knows that, within the limited space available to me, I have spent enough time on getting those speakers just right. Plus, my LS50s are supposed to be imaging demons.

I’ve talked to people about this, including some people who work at high-end audio stores. Most of them commiserate. It’s a problem, they said. “It usually only happens with acoustic music,” most of them said. Strike one. My diet of indie rock and contemporary jazz doesn’t have much of that. “You’ve got to have your chair set up just right. And you’ve got to hold your head in just the right place.” Strike two. Who wants to do that?

(Most of the people reading this forum, probably. But I can’t think of any time or purpose for which I’ve held my head in a vise-like grip like that.)

It happens, every now and then. For some reason, I was once right up next to my speakers. Lots of direct sound, less reflections. “The Name Of This Band Is Talking Heads” was playing. And I literally gave a start because David Byrne was standing on the coffee table. Cool.

But, generally speaking, imaging is something I only read about. And if that little bit of imaging is the dividend of dropping more money into my system, I’m not sure that I want to deposit into that account.

I think that I still have a few steps to take that will pay benefits other than imaging. But maybe the high-end is not for me.

paul6002
musicfan2349's avatar
musicfan2349
233 posts
 

Hmm, where to begin? One of the main qualities of "stereo" is to provide a sense of space and placement. Wiki has a pretty decent article about it:

So in that regard, imaging is rather important element of stereo else we’d all have one speaker and listening monaurally. It certainly is to me as I’ve kept and and enjoyed my Acoustat 1+1s since new. What they lack in punch and absolute definition they make up for in imaging. Their imaging, granted after LOTS of placement/tuning, always brings a smile to my face.

I must say that one thing that helps is closing my eyes. Suddenly a soundstage mentally appears and it’s quite easy to "see" where the performers are. Or, to be more accurate, where the producer/engineer put them in the case of close mic’ed studio recordings. Live recordings are different of course, especially orchestral music.

Now does that mean imaging should be as important to you? No, of course not. It sounds to me that you value other components of a musical performance. Tonal qualities like balance and definition. Maybe it’s dynamics. You mentioned that you had toed-in your speakers once and found them too bright. That implies to me that you value finding a tonal balance that is pleasing versus placement/imaging.

One of the things I find fun about this hobby is tinkering with speaker placement and hearing the different effects it can have. When you can, spend an afternoon or evening playing with just that. Pick a couple familiar albums and see how different your system will sound by moving your speakers a bit.

One thing that somewhat concerns me is you say you have no listening chair. If you aren’t in one spot but up wandering about, you can likely just forget imaging. If you read the article in the link you see why. Anyways, have fun!

Happy listening...🎶

Post removed 
bkeske's avatar
bkeske
5,597 posts
 

Of course, with a poorly recorded release, no matter what we do, we cannot achieve the imaging we may desire. The recording technique is very important.

As I listen to a lot of classical, and jazz, locating those musicians in the space, correctly, is important to me. Rock, pop, alternative, even much folk/folk rock, does not often have precise imaging, and it’s a bit more of a spacial excitement not ground in reality. Thus, less important in its authenticity. Nonetheless, important, to me.

I also believe speaker setup is the most important ingredient. Lesser speakers can probably still achieve it with proper setup. Perhaps just not as well defined as a speaker designed with imaging in mind.

 

 

paul6001
98 posts
 
sbank says " Your OP sounds like you're hoping we'll all chime in and tell that it's not worth it, because you don't want to set up your room in a way that will optimize the sound reproduction that your gear is capable of. "

(Why is my font so small?)

Is that it, sbank? Am I looking for validation for my laziness?

I've given that question a moment of introspection, perhaps a moment more than it deserves, and decided that I'm doing Okay. God knows that, within the confines of my room, I've spent plenty of time trying to get the best speaker placement. I think that I've done all that can be done, even if my set-up is not ideal. 

I do take some comfort in the number of people taking the "not worth the chase" position. Obviously I'm turning thoughtful, nuanced posts into an easy yes/no position but I think everyone but the pedants will get my meaning. (Another disclaimer I shouldn't have to make.) It makes me feel better about my system.

(And myself? Maybe a little, as strange (and sad) as that might be) be.)

I will walk away thinking that imaging would be nice if I could get it, but it's not the be all and end all. As I said up top, even if I could get the perfect sound set-up, I don't think that I could keep my head still long enough to get everything that imaging could offer.

Thanks to those who are responsible for the comfort I've received. I'm sure that wasn't the cause of your post but it is a welcome effect. Now, I'm going to Whole Foods. During the walk I'm going to think about the my system/myself conundrum. Certainly grist for my next post. Which I'm going to make right now. Whole Foods can wait.

paul6001
98 posts
 

I think  my font is okay. Just looks small as I type it.

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