2. cables
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Yes, cables do make a difference -- regardless of price...

I thought you may find this interesting…or not.  I know, another "cable post".  Disclaimer up front — I am a believer that cables can make a difference in the sound that you hear from your system.  With my speakers, like most high(er) efficiency speakers, I can hear large and small changes made to the system components — and cables are part of that system.

What I want to share is an exercise that I went through with my better half in setting up her recording equipment that she will be using to record audio books.  The hardware part of the system is simple:  Audio Technica Cardioid Condenser Microphone AT2035 connected with a XLR cable to the Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 preamp.

We started with the XLR cable that came with the microphone and recorded the short introduction of the book she has been contracted to record.  Then she recorded the same section using each of the our XLR cables I have on hand:  Vovox Excelsus, Mogami 2549, Gotham GAC-3, and Grimm TPR. Each of the cables have the same Neutrik connector and are very good studio cables that I have used in my system at one time.

Listening through headphones via the Scarlett 2i2, it was super easy to hear distinct differences in these cables.  The differences were not small and very apparent.  In the end, the Mogami cable was the winner — it seemed more open and warmer than the other cables and suited the tone of her voice the best. I have heard similar differences from these cables in my stereo system but not to the significant degree borne out by this exercise. 

To keep going, today I replaced the $10 USB C to C cable that I bought as an “upgrade” from the Scarlett 2i2 to a MacBook Air with a $70 Audioquest Forest cable. We were more than surprised that with the AQ cable in the system the drop of the noise floor was very significant and the blackness of background made the sound even more crystal clear.

The purpose of this post is not to promote or compares cables, just a public service posting for those of you who do not believe cables make a difference.  They really do affect how your system sounds (positive or negative) and if you cannot hear a difference then maybe looking at the transparency of your system is a place you should examine.

Imagine peace everyone.

crozbo
rodman99999
5,988 posts
 
                                                  A years old rewind:
 

        Anyone needing a rationale for experimenting with new cables in their system and/or feeling dissuaded by the Church of Denyin'tology's antiquated electrical doctrines: take heart!

        Many new electrical facts have been established in the past 100 years, that support audible differences, between various cables, fuses, etc.

         I couldn't find anything like, "Updated Electrical Theory For Idiots", but- did manage to find something resembling a cartoon, that even a child could follow.  It neither mentions AC/sinusoidal waves in wires, nor does it go into the photon propagation of electromagnetic waves.   It does, however, emphasize/demonstrate how Electrical Theory has progressed, since the 1800s:

              (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGJqykotjog)

        These next two presuppose a certain amount of knowledge, in the field of modern Electrical Theory.    Click, "continue reading" in the first link's first answer, to get its entirety.    Note how it mentions the OLD, "... commonly held misconception that the flow of electricity through a wire resembles a tube filled with ping pong balls...", to which the Denyin'tologists fervently adhere: 

https://www.quora.com/Are-photons-involved-in-all-forms-of-electricity-for-example-when-it-flows-through-wires?utm_medium=organic&utm_source=google_rich_qa&utm_campaign=google_rich_qa

                                            and:

        https://van.physics.illinois.edu/qa/listing.php?id=2348

        It's an established (measured) fact that an electromagnetic wave's propagation and speed, are dependent on the materials, of which the transmission line (cable) are made (ie: Dielectric Constant/permittivity).     The better (lower) the Dielectric Constant the better the flow and the longer it takes for that material, to become polarized.     One reason anything that comprises an RLC circuit (ie: capacitors, cables, PC boards), takes time to, "form", or, "break/burn-in".*      

          *Something that makes the Denyin'tologists apoplectic.

   https://resources.pcb.cadence.com/blog/2019-dielectric-constant-of-pcb-substrate-materials-and-signa....

https://unlcms.unl.edu/cas/physics/tsymbal/teaching/EM-914/section5-Guided_Waves.pdf

          Even the most inane (regarding the Sciences) must admit; braiding and twisting wires eliminates/reduces EMI interference.              
          That must lend credence to various cable geometries.

          That better dielectrics enhance the propagation of electromagnetic waves (ie: your music signal), lends the same credence to choosing cables with better materials (ie: Polypropylene, Teflon, air, etc).

           Of course: anything the Church of Denyin'tology's popes can't fathom, they'll summarily dismiss.

     

         As simple a device as a fuse is: it still carries a sinusoidal signal/voltage, ALWAYS from source to load.

                                                 NOT back and forth!

         Also (as mentioned above): any fuse acts as an RLC circuit, the 'C' of which will be determined by properties of its wave guide's/ conductor's surroundings (ie: glass, air, bee's wax, ceramic, end cap materials, etc).

          Any commonly drawn wire will exhibit a chevron pattern in its crystal lattice, so: why not "directionality" and why OHNO Continuous Cast, single crystal wire sounds better, to so many?

 

                   Stated above are scientifically tested, measured and proven facts. 

                                  There is no "contest", or "dispute" involved.

 

         The OP mentions Maxwell, but: obviously they have no understanding of his theory and possible ramifications as regards the above.

  

          Anyone that feels compelled to harp on not hearing any differences, is obviously too obtuse to understand the term "variables" (as frequently mentioned) and worthy of disregard.

  

          My only goal in these threads has ever been to encourage those with a curious, rational, functioning mind to experiment with their systems, based on the latest (20th/21st Century's) findings of ACTUAL Physics/science and ignore the Cargo Cult's incessant runway building (objections, convolutions, deflections and obfuscations).

 

                                           Happy listening!

kirk9
43 posts
 

@ donavabdear

Because distance matters.

The miles of current to your system don't matter as long as it arrives cleanly - it never carries the music.

The points of contact inside your components don't matter near as much because they are so short. The signal does not degrade near as much as going through 10' or so of cable.

p05129
482 posts
 

Why do you think that people looking at cables haven’t already spent many thousands on acoustics? System synergy? Room dimensions? It’s pretty stupid to by a $200k Porsche and put  $50 Toyota tires on it. When you spend thousands, tens of thousands or more on a system, why not audition cables to get the most out of your purchase. Every cable has a different sound, can be good, can be bad.

But if you have a cheaper system/cheaper car, cables/tires aren’t going to make a big difference. You can only get so much out of a cheaper system or a cheaper car.

atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,597 posts
 

I commonly hear people say that they want their system to sound like the "real thing".  But of course that is never going to happen since you do not know what the "real thing" originally sounded like.  What you mean, I suspect, is that you want it to sound like your interpretation of what you think the "real thing" should sound like.

@crozbo It helps a lot to use recordings you made yourself, because you were there when it was recorded, huh! 😀

If you even get a chance to try equipment that supports AES48 (which is likely a bit more expensive) I'd be interested to hear if you still hear the same differences.

When the standard isn't supported, the shield of the cable becomes the signal return path, just as it is in an RCA cable. So its more susceptible to noise and the construction of the cable itself. Not only that but you lose immunity to ground loops. Cable immunity and immunity to ground loops are two things that the balanced line system is supposed to eliminate, along with reduced noise (Common Mode rejection of noise; CMRR).

So if the standard isn't supported, you're likely to hear cable differences. I think this is why the single-ended vs balanced thing is an on-going thing in high end audio since so little of high end audio equipment supports the standard.

 

shdr
3 posts
 

I know that cables make a difference sometimes but the acoustic treatment of the listening area always makes a huge difference way more than any cable . I had a set of transparent audio reference cables for many years and I must say that benchmark media speaker cable did not sound worse or different.

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