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The Shure V15 V with a Jico SAS/B stylus VS The Soundsmith Hyperion MR and Lyra Atlas SL

On a sentimental lark I purchased two Shure V15 V bodies and one SAS/B stylus. I was always a realistic about the Shure's potential. Was comparing it to $10k+ cartridges fair? Absolutely. The Shure was considered to be one of the best cartridges of the day. Why not compare it to a few of the best we have today?

The Shure has always been considered to be unfailingly neutral. Famous recording engineers have said it sounded most like their master tapes. I do not have an original stylus for the Shure and I can not say that the Jico performs as well. 

My initial evaluation was quite positive. It worked wonderfully well in the Shroder CB. With a light mounting plate and small counterbalance weight a resonance point of 8 hz was easily achieved. There was nothing blatantly wrong with the sound. There was no mistracking at 1.2 grams. You can see pictures of all these styluses here https://imgur.com/gallery/stylus-photomicrographs-51n5VF9 

After listening to a bunch of favorite evaluation records my impression was that the Shure sounded on the thin side, lacking in the utmost dynamic impact with just a touch of harshness. I listened to the Shure only for four weeks as my MC phono stage had taken a trip back to the factory. I was using the MM phono stage in the DEQX Pre 8, designed by Dynavector. I have used it with a step up transformer and know it performs well. I got my MC stage back last week and cycled through my other cartridges then back to the Shure. The Soundsmith and Lyra are much more alike than different. I could easily not be able to tell which one was playing. The Lyra is the slightest touch darker. The Shure is a great value....for $480 in today's money, but it can not hold a candle to the other cartridges. They are more dynamic, smoother and quieter. They are more like my high resolution digital files. Whether or not they are $10,000 better is a personal issue. Did the DEQX's phono stage contribute to this lopsided result? Only to a small degree if any. I do have two Shure bodies and they both sound exactly the same. The Shure may have done better with a stock stylus. I do not think the age of the bodies contributes to this result at all. 

128x128mijostyn
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lewm
13,279 posts
 

It occurred to me that Grace recommended 400pF capacitance for the Ruby. 400pF with 47K ohms gives the same RC constant as 200pF (where I’m usually at, approximately) with 100K ohms. And yet it sounds different.

dover
2,262 posts
 

@rauliruegas @lewm 

Your recommendations on loaiding and capacitance are garbage.

According to independent measurements of the Shure V15vmr in High Fidelity Magazine in 1984 ( unfortunately I can't post pictures ) the frequency response at the loading AS RECOMMENDED BY SHURE 47k and 250pf the response was flat to 15k.

See middle of page 41 in the link below.

https://www.worldradiohistory.com/Archive-All-Audio/Archive-High-Fidelity/80s/High-Fidelity-1984-12.pdf

I very much doubt whether either of you has actually ever heard the Shure in your own system, because loading at 100k will generate a large high frequency peak.

My own experience having owned both the V15vmr and V15vxmr from new, with a variety of phono stages is the SHURES RECOMMENDED LOADING OF 47K and 250pf is the most accurate response.

 

lewm
13,279 posts
 

I made no recommendation at all, particularly with respect to loading the Shure. I’ve only related my own experience with loading MM (particularly the Grace Ruby) and high output MI cartridges other than the Shure, in much more recent years. A reader can take it or leave it. When I did own a V15 (probably the III version, and surely in the 70s or early 80s), I’m quite sure I loaded it conventionally, and it nevertheless did not engage my long term admiration. I remember it as dry and lifeless. As I recall your saying further up the thread, you were not a fan, either. Mijo has a later version of the V15 with an aftermarket stylus, so his cartridge may exhibit very different character from mine.

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