ELP laser turntable - any comments?


I tried searching for info on the ELP laser tt here and was surprised to find nothing. i'd love to hear comments from true vinyl lovers: how does this compare to other rigs you've heard?
if you're curious, the website is www.audioturntable.com
kublakhan
What can we say? There are many positive and negative comments about the laser turntable in the industry. Most negative ones are from those that have not heard it or refuse to "hear" it when they are listening to it. As a dealer we have compared it to many conventional turntables and many other formats including master tape . There is no comparison out there unless you are spending upwards of $20-$60,000.00. You must hear the laser turntable for yourself and make your own judgement. If you can afford it we welcome anyone to send us a deposit . We will then ship them one to demo for 2 weeks and let them decide what is and what should never be. Once you hear it in your system you will never want to let it go. Believe it!
don't believe all the other crap you read on the internet. I use my LT daily and am enthralled at every record I feed it even after 2 years! amazing!
I've got a question about worn records...I've both heard that actual groove wear (like distortion on an old disc played with a bad stylus) can be virtually eliminated sometimes, and yet both owners here say wear is worse on the ELP. I'm just curious, since there seem to be very different opinions out there about how it handles wear. I've heard that scratches can reproduce worse on the ELP, but not groove wear, so I'm just wondering what your experience is a little more specifically (if you don't mind sharing!)

Thanks!
I posted this mini review on the Audio Asylum Vinyl forum.
This cross-post adds some revisions and updates.

I own an ELP (about 18 months). I like it. Sounds quite different from a conventional table. I also have a conventional table: Basis 2800/Graham 2.2/Helikon.

Cavets: as noted a RCM is essential not optional. But this is really true for all good vinyl playback IMHO, just more so for the laser. The laser will not play all vinyl. Yes it wants black discs but occassionally I will come across a black vinyl disc that the laser simply won't read. I don't know why. This is rare. In general I prefer the sound I get from the laser to my Basis rig. Mike Fremer's review I find is generally on point although I don't think he spent enough time with the unit to really assess its' strengths. Bottom line: if you can only afford one table don't buy the laser. But if you can afford a second table, and you really like your vinyl, I would encourage you to listen for yourself in your own system. BTW I have been using a VPI 16.5 but just ordered a Loricraft.

Assuming you find the sonics of the laser to be of high quality you will be very happy with the convienence of the unit. I put a record in the system (after cleaning!) and can listen to any track in any order. No worry about when the record will end. I can pause and resume: nice when watching TV - I listen to vinyl during the commerical breaks :) And no danger of damage to the record. I like that. No '24 hour rule' for those concerned about this - play any track over and over again as often as you wish. New vinyl stays new - see below for more on this.

The the build quality of the unit is at the upper end consumer level- think Sony/Denon/Pioneer . It is not audiophile jewelry by any means. However in over a year of operation I have not had any problems. It is expensive only in the sense that it is priced at the same level as a really good table/arm/cartridge but is not at the build level audiophiles generally lust for.

A side rant:

Ok I admit: I am an unrepentant audiophile.... 40 years since my dad took me to my first audio store. For me it's not just the music! I enjoy my audio jewelry with the warm glow of tubes, sensuous controls, gracious ergonomics and sexy metal work etc. I know I'm not alone. We know who we are! It's a great hobby made even more wonderful by an never ending supply and infinite variety of sound and music.

Got it off my chest, back to earth:

To address the worn record question posed by vanmeterannie: it's kind of a mix. Most of the time worn records do very well with the ELP. For example - I've got a really old copy of Abby Lincoln's 'Abby is Blue' (given to me by my mother!) which was really beat up and badly treated. Did not sound good at all on my standard rig but just outstanding on the ELP. On the other hand some records that are really badly worn can be 'played' on my Basis (sound awful) but just can't be played on the laser. I'm an avid collector of old vinyl and I would say overall that the ELP is a godsend for beaten up vinyl (with a good cleaning) but as MF noted in his review of the ELP "not always and not predictably so."

With new vinyl the ELP can be glorious; in particular on single sided 45rpm recordings (some of my best stuff) the ELP sonics are just fantastic. (Cleaning is still necessary) To my ears you lose some very low frequency 'grung' (vibrational artifacts?) which at first makes it seem like something is missing. However after going back and forth between the ELP and Basis I find the ELP makes for a more realistic (accurate?) but perhaps not always a more pleasing presentation. Low level detail is better elucidated, soundstage and imaging are more acurate (less 'bloating'), presence is enhanced. However there is a sense of decreased dynamic range which I note particularly when listening to rock or orchestral pieces. In the words of one stereophile reviewer the ELP works best for a 'they are here' and not a 'you are there' sonic experience. (This however is the bias of my system built around doublestacked Quad 63s with Halcro electronics).

One thing I haven't heard mentioned but I find strange is that if I have my speakers muted and I listen with my ear close to the unit I can hear the record being played; this is similar to the vibrational sonics I get from my cartridge. I would not have thought that this would be so.

Given this observation I plan to experiment with vibrational isolation to improve the sound of the ELP. I have found such efforts to pay off modestly with digital reproduction and so had expected some improvement with the ELP. Now I am excited that I might have some dramatic improvements in performance with attention to this detail. I'll report back when I've made some meaningful observations about this.

I think the best way to look at the ELP is not as an alternative to a standard TT, but as an alternative way of listening to your vinyl. If it suceeds commercially I would hope/expect that more luxury oriented units, perhaps with the newer 'blueray' (smaller) type lasers, as well as less expensive units will be in the offing.

Well you've heard my opinion. YMMV.
Cjsmithmd, thanks for a cogent review. Your findings go along with the several auditions I have had with the ELP. I still remember vividly the Peggy Lee old recording that SMART played at the CES several years ago, which had been purchased in Vegas and cleaned with the Loricraft. It had the immediacy of a master tape and where we focused the laser in the groove greatly affected the sound. Were it not for having the Shindo Labs/Garrard 301 system and having heard the criticism and faint praise of the reviews, I would no doubt have one today.

Perhaps tomorrow I will.