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The end of LP collecting????

I don't know about most of you but I am a joe six pack fince kind of guy and it bums me out that I keep seeing prices of equipment becaome more and more rediculous.That's why, say with amplification I ike a companies like Quicksilver,Rogue,VTL etc where just getting a set up that sound sbetter than mid-fi (and of course there budget companies for source compenet and spoeakers) where buying their products does not insult your inteliigence,But being a guy whao over tha past 6 years ghhas amazzes a pretty decent collection of LP's off EBAY the party seesms to be over.Yes we all wish we bought items before we di (Micorsoft in '83) or a split window Corvette jst to store away the wholeLP thing at least one ebay (which dtermines prices at shows and shops) the prices over the past 12 or pwerhaps 18 months has just gotten totally out of hand.Lp's that could get over the couple of years say $60 in mint conditon (like a Prestige Miles) not regularly go for $100..Bassically prices have doubled or trippled in one year.I know supply /demand but the supply has been static but I find it weird that everyone and his cousin finally disocvered Ebay even though it's been a forum for years.Blue Notesin particular have eneded up primarily Japan for quite some time but now the prices have just gobne nuts.Yes a goofd copy of a lowproduction item like Tina Brooks (made propular by the Mosaic set wheu\ic revived (or in fact started his fame-read his bio it was sad a talented guy who recorded as a dideman for a few Blue Note guys like McLean,Hubbard, or Burrell) but he himself recoded 4 LP's for Lyon and Wollf.But sales were so poor with the first titled "True Blue" that the other 3 staid in the can until Cuscuna brought them out on Mosaic.all of a suden copies would reguarlly go for $1500 when 10 yeas before they were bought for $5 in some cut out bin.But now a regular Mobley 1500 series LP will go for $2K.Barney Wilen excellent (Buy it for $8 on CD on Vogue) goes for $2500.And jusyt last week I sawa Sihab Shihab "With The Dabish Radio Orchestra ": go for $1800 pounds.You do the conversion.Iam satisfied with my $25 CD re-issue.But it's all taken the fun out of it for me siunce the priceing ( three or four players WILL get an LP they want no matter what.I guess if I was woth a few million I woulkd be that guy.I am only glad that since 1995 or so with 2 bit K2 [processing CD's are finally soundiong acceptable not terribel like they did for the fisrt fifteen years of "the ultimate media".And some red book CD's sound as good as SACD's.Still there is nothing more depressing than wanmting a say Prestige LP and only having the CD otion (foget the OJC LP's.Re-melt wax combine with re-melt something that has made LP's in general suck sinc the late 60's).Thank goodness for comapines like Clasic Records which have made soemre-0issue using original tapes,stampers etc and in some cases sound as f\good as the oru\iginal LP>And then there are comanies like Mapple shade which use no board for EQ,compression, etc-no board at all just mike to tape.Then there is the Japanese comany Venus whose "24 Bit Hyper Magnum Sound" is incredible either on CD or LP.Take the terrrfic Archie Shepp Ballad LP's like "True Blue","Tru Romance' etc (four in all I think)The Lp's have a great tactile sound and warmth that only Lp's cab provide but of course you lose some of the fdynamic range you get with CD's.And all of this from digital tape so nobody can tell me that LP'scan only sound good with analogue tape-these LP's are great.I stopped running the jazz section of CD stereo equipment store 4 years ago and just before i left did CVD's start to sound "right".SACD's,DVD Audio,BlueLight or other digital formats maybe the salvation for a guy like me.But there some of my jazz Lp's that maybe got pressed in a few hundred companies and I am doubtfull all of them will make it to market.So maybe I should just borrow my freinds trumpet and play taps for my beloved hobby.The groove factor of the cover srt and it's size,finding a clean flat edge preesing with adep grove with "Rudy Van Gelder" and the little "ear mark(swirl) that indicated a fuisrt press well it's a pleasure that isn't going to vcome down the pipe that ofetn and while I like the fact that mire and mre folks seem to be digging the "New Thing" that is now 40 or 50 years old great the recent spike of LP's is just plain depressing.
Chazzbo
chazzbo
jyprez's avatar
jyprez
241 posts
 
I don't think the prices on Ebay are so outrageous when you consider what this portal provides (well OK a few bidders go way overboard). But how else would you access such an exceptional archive of jazz records? It would have taken me multiple lifetimes to find the stuff that I can find with a few keystrokes on Ebay. Yes, this is a quality over quantity solution. If you are into $1.99 LP's then forget about Ebay but if you are into pristine copies of classic jazz from the 50's that you could only dream about possibly finding someday, then Ebay is a dream come true. My average LP purchase on Ebay is $70 - $100 for a classic Prestige, Savoy, Blue Note etc. I consider it a deal since I would spend this much or more in gas and other expenses just to find such items and here others find them for me and I can purchase them with a few keystrokes from my PC. This is the golden age of LP collecting from my perspective!
gadfly's avatar
gadfly
194 posts
 
No, really, I am of the same mind. My post meant only to elucidate the issue. [Sorry to say I flubbed.]

Buying LPs as an investment is greedy, vapid, etc. Will those records ever get listened to again? As an investment they must be kept in best condition so, no, they will never rest on a turntable again. That is the future of LPs along this train. NOW WHAT THE HELL GOOD IS THAT EXCEPT FOR $$$!?!?!?

My OPINION is that speculators will drive up the price and add NOTHING to the enjoyment.

Are they 'allowed' to do that? sure. so what?

To all my frieeeeeennds, -barfly.;-)
gadfly's avatar
gadfly
194 posts
 
I've got to say that $70 dollars for a record is a wee bit high. I can now get first issue mono/stereo jazz LPs on labels such as MUSE, Prestige, etc because the local record store is frequented by a lot of DJs who, I assume, dump their LPs when this stuff comes out on CD. The cost of these LPs is less than $10. c'mon - $70 for ONE record on average!!! pshew.

I don't know ... I just don't know.
jyprez's avatar
jyprez
241 posts
 
Chazzbo, I have found the blue note reissues from the 70's (the ones with a blue label and black B) to be a very good value if you don't want to shell out gazzillions for originals. They are better than the later Park Ave Blue Note reissues or OJC's (both of which you can tell from listening were digitally remastered) and they can usually be found for under $20 for a double LP. In fact the price they demand is so low that unfortunately many sellers don't bother to list them. They are usually in much better condition than the original issues as well - many are essentially mint.
The same can be said of 70's reissues under other labels. I recently acquired a copy of a two-fer of Cannonball Adderly on Savoy from the 70's called "Spontaneous Combustion". This includes a reissue of Bohemia After Dark (Kenny Clarke's album but Cannonball's debut) and the 1955 Savoy "Presenting Cannonball". Since I own originals of both LP's I did a listening comparison and was amazed to find that the reissue actually sounded better having corrected mixing problems on the originals! Best of all, the reissue cost $12 compared to over $150 that I paid for the originals and was in mint condition!
opalchip
355 posts
 
Anybody buying LP's as a long term investment at current prices is dreamin'. If you had the foresight to do it 10 years ago, that's another story. But buying now at these prices better be because you love vinyl and never plan on reselling.

Domestic prices are high because Baby Boomers who have lots of cash from refinancing their homes are chasing their memories, and Gen X is (still) chasing what they think is "cool". "Mod" is the profitable buzzword for anything selling on Ebay - put that in your title and get an extra 25%. Once these generations are over all that (which won't be long) prices on nearly all genres, etc. will decline. The DJ craze contributed to LP's reaching the younger generations - but many DJ's are moving to CD Decks now. And once the fad cools do you really think the younger crowd is going to care about 50's/60's jazz or 60's "psych" or Pink Floyd and Led Zep? - no more than the Boomers now care about the previous generations' Glenn Miller, Rosemary Clooney, or Artie Shaw. Or even - Doo Wop - remember that. Five Satins and Coasters records were going for big bucks in the 70's and early 80's.

Do you think the next generation is going to have the time and money to throw tens of thousands of $$$ at wildly priced collectible LP's instead of an acceptable sounding consumer format? They're going to be working 16 hour days just trying to buy a house and pay for their kids' kindergarten.

Overseas prices are up now because (classical mostly) lp's are a popular in Asia right now. For a while it was Deutsche Grammophon over there - then they figured out those were crap, then it was anything with a cello in the title - now that's cooling a bit. "Unaccompanied" Bach of any sort is hot but slowing. We've seen what happens with most Asian fads. They get dropped like a stone very suddenly for the next big thing.

Everything is a Beanie Baby right now - "Income" properties sporting negative cash flow and bought with Negative Amortization loans, hot Stock Offerings in unprofitable Solar Power and Search Engine companies, Muscle Cars, "vintage" crap from the '80's, and yes - LP's. There's like 12 or 15 amateur "dealers" who hang around my local Goodwill stores looking for anything they can put on Ebay. People are buying portfolios of unknown, not particularly talented, artists' works as investments figuring, assured by art dealers that they'll score with one or two of them. People are advertising beat up lp's of Abbey Road or Magical Mystery Tour on Craigslist here in San Francisco for hundreds of dollars, thinking they found a real score in their parents closet.

Our economy is totally dependent on foreigners lending us ever-increasing amounts of our own money back, our kids can't afford to buy gasoline, not to mention houses, our politicians' ethics are at a deplorable low, our reputation around the world is in shambles, our high tech military has been shown to be an emperor with no clothes. - And we just can't get enough beat up old "Northern Soul" 45's and Blue Note lp's. Keep bidding! It's a cultural phase of greed and delusion that the US is going through and it'll end just as every other phase has.

At the same time, no doubt, a digital or even some new analog format that makes mincemeat of Vinyl will come along and we'll all be quaint old men with a bunch of old-timey records destined to be given away to someone who'll just take 'em after we're gone.

I have many big $$$ records that my wife would love for me to put on Ebay - and I would if profit was the motive. If ever there was a time to be selling it is NOW. But I ain't selling my good ones - I'm buying more, because it's fun. BUT - I consider the cost as an "expense" not as an "investment"!
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