Balanced in phono stages preamp?

Herman, I think I agree with you :^).

I have some balanced stuff and run it with balanced cable because I think it's a little bit better that way.

But who knows, perhaps if it had been designed from day one as single ended it would sound better than it does now in balanced.

Interesting comments for sure.

A balanced electrical interface is almost immune to spurious signal pickup: eg: hum. When using single ended interconnects I have never had a problem with noise pickup, but I have had a phono cartridge circuit pretend it's a radio. Balanced configuration makes more sense for a high gain phono input than for any other part of the system.

Actually, I do use some balanced wires, but this is because the equipment is pro sound stuff, and that's the way it is made. I have used some of this equipment single ended, and it worked fine that way also.

>>And since phono cartridges are balanced<<

This is simply not true. I'm suprised you would continue to actively propogate this myth. If anyone understands the beauty of balanced circuits and signalling, it's you. You get it.

So why pretend a two-wire device is balanced? It's not. A cartridge is floating single-ended. Balanced operation require three terminals: a common (mid-point, average, reference), a positive polarity, and a negative polarity. You don't have that with a cartridge.

Nonetheless, as I pointed out in another thread, a proper receiver can force a cartridge into balanced mode. This is done by using a center tap on the primary of a step-up transformer. The center tap connects to ground. The windings then force the cartridge to act as if it were balanced (but without the 6dB gain). I wonder how many of these so-called balanced phonostages actually do this. And how many simply connect one cartridge tap to ground and pretend?

jh

Dear Pedrillo: Jeff, Herman and Hagtech are totally right the cartridge is not a balanced device.

I was surprised at Spencer place when I read in the Atmasphere operation manual that the cartridge is balanced, it is not.

Herman, balanced it is not hype: in a fully differential well made design the distortions/noises are canceled inside the circuit ( I'm not talking here of interconnect/speaker cables ) and this subject is extremely critical in a Phonolinepreamp, could you tell us why is only " hype " ?

Hagteck, our design is real input to output balanced one, no " charlatan " seudo-balanced design.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Raul, good to hear from you. What is this "our design" you speak of?

I agree there are some theoretical advantages to differential designs; however we both know that many balanced devices are not differential. I believe Atmasphere's are but many (most?) are not.

By hype I mean the advantages are outweighed by the complexity of the circuits, and the ability to reject common mode noise is simply not needed in the home environment. The only exception I can see where it might come in handy is the very early stages in a phono stage. Otherwise, why take an inherently single ended source, convert it to balanced, and handle it that way only to recombine the 2 polarities at the speaker? Most of those who are trying to sell balanced equipment take advantage of the fact that the average consumer doesn't understand the circuits. They tout the advantage of noise rejection (which isn’t needed) and love to point out that pro audio uses it (which isn’t relevant.)

As you may know I feel simplicity is the key to good sound. Balanced circuits don’t fit in with this philosophy. My amplifier has 3 SETs directly coupled. My phono stage has a step up followed by 2 stages of amplification with the RIAA in between. With high efficiency speakers this is all you need.