New2Analog - Table Setup Help?

Wrong expectations? I think not. Hopefull yes. Hope is good!Without it where would we be?

The problem is to get the most out of the grooves in the quietest way possible requires a certain reality.

Sorry if my spelling is off but I am on my wifes Vista Computer. Worse than a CD.

And unfortunately that will cost. I wonder if anyone has done a price per value on this.

There are no shortcuts.

I recently played an 1961 album bought probably 4th hand; Chopin Concerto No. 1 played by Arthur Rubenstein. There is no way in hell the playback equipment could do it justice in 61. Yet the artistry and care was taken to do it the best it could be done even knowing that it was probably somewhat wasted (before marketing....). I was blown away by the recording (and no noise). As an aside from an ill informed soul in this post, I have records I have played a hundred times and I would argue there has been NO sonic loss. On the contrary the grooves maybe better than ever...

So, while I can't answer if analog is worth it for you or anyone else I can say it is a commitment, an investment that if done well yields more daily yearly than my 401k (all recent crashes aside).

The game. You are in or your not. Not for everyone. Appreciate the art form or not. That is your choice.
But it can yield great results.

UPDATE - UPDATE!

I took my table to a friend who know turntables well, and we made a couple of changes. We changed out the stock cartridge and installed the LP-Gear upgraded cartridge. We used the Shure pressure measurement, and set the force to 2gm. We found one of the wires connecting to the old cartridge disconnected! These are the only changes, and when we put it into his system, both of us were quite pleased. We did some A-B comparison to CD, and agreed on the following:
Vinyl was a bit laid back to the CD
CD was certianly clear, but sterle
Vinyl made instruments sound true.
Drums had a deeper timber sound - you could tell size between them more than a "thund or bang" of CD
Horns of all types were more realistic

I liked it, packed it up, and brought it home to install in my system. The next day, I listened to a couple of my records (I only had 6), and was quite happy in my system too.

Yesterday, I went out and bought a number of records. I found the ColdPlay and Robert Plant/Alison Krause Grammy winning records at two different stores new, and bought em. I also picked up a 1968 sealed recording of Stravinsky's Fireworks performed by the Chicago Symphony, and Tchaikovsky's Nutcracker Suite performed by the Paris Orchestra in the early 70s (Sealed). Both of these prints were filled with snap crackle and POP. It was quite annoying, especially since I bought sealed copies. I ran a Disk Washer kit over them, but it had no affect.

I then played a used copy of the soundtrack from FM, and it was ok, but my expectation was there would be a fair amount of static sound to it.

Not shure what may have happened. I know one of the sealed copies was FILLED with static electricity - how do I get rid of that??

Still trying to figure out if this is all worth it.... I like it - but not if I have to have tons of noise on 20% of the music I listen to..

Jeff

Jeff,

You have to be careful about 'sealed' records. Some are what you might better call 'resealed'! If you really get into vinyl, than a wet cleaning machine like a VPI or a Moth is essential, especially if you buy used vinyl.

I buy a lot of second hand LPs,which when cleaned, sound pretty good. The cartridge/tonearm combination is pretty important in determining the surface noise level. to much you can do about that in a budget TT apart from changing the cartridge as you have done.

Some cheaper MM cartridges you might want to check out include
Nagaoka MP11 (cheap GBP45)
Audio Technica 440 ML (more expensive GBP160)
Denon high output MCs DL110 (GBP70) or DL160 (GBP90)

Best wishes,

Charlie

There are a number of threads discussing the static subject. A sure-fire static killer is a Zerostat 3 gun. I will not play an lp without it.

Okay, I spent the weekend listening to my new, but small, record collection. None of the records seemed to be staticly charged this weekend, and listening was much better. I still found a fair amount of snaps and pops, but nothing like I experienced after I opened a record, pulled it out, and put it on the table for the first time.

I did begin to use the Disc Dr I purchased nearly all the time, and ensured that the records were completely dry before dropping the needle.

What amazed me the most, is the contrast in my records from a noise standpoint. I purchased the following records since I bought the table:

- used, but in good condition, disc dr only
- used, but cleaned in a 3-step system on a VPI 17f record cleaning machine by previous owner (VERY Through in his Collection!)
- New, but very old 1968 & 1973 vintage
- New, and very recent

The used in good condition I bought from a used record store, and the had a fair amount of noise, but for the $$ not bad. Due to the noise, I would not "repeat" listen as often as others.

The used, incredibly cared and cleaned were by far the quietist records of my collection. I am amazed at the silence of a Art Pepper 1990 LP (Incredible JAZZ). The Alan Parson is quite nice too, and Garbage is AWESOME on my table, with ZERO noise. I think try and buy more from this collector!

The new sealed, but old records were by far the biggest dissapointment. LOTS of noise, that did settle down now that there is no more static, but still, they are filled with far more noise than I would like. They are all classical records, and the noise just stands out...pop- - snap - -

The new - new (Pink Floyd DSOM 30th) sounds incredible, the Robert Plant-Alison Krause is great, but with some noise, and Cold Play is a bit dissapointing (a good amount of snap - pop etc..).

So, why would I have these issues with new vinyl specifically? If I can not trust new vinyl, how can I trust the used market, unless I only have one source - my guy that sold me the Alan Parsons, Garbage, and Art Pepper!

I guess the common point is the need for good cleaning? Do I really need to spend $1200-1500 on a record cleaner, and another $50 on all the solvents to get them in that pop free shape?

Regarding some critical listening - I did love the sounds I heard this weekend, but I did bounce between CD and Vinyl where I could (Cold Play, Dire Straits, Alan Parsons, Fleetwood Mac Rumors), and found a consistant signature of my table. There is more weight to the midrange and lower end of the upper octaves, where with CD, the upper octaves are more forward. I do hear the purity of the instruments in vinyl, but I am missing some of the upper air. That I recognize as the difference between a $300 turntable/PhonoPre combination, and a better table/phonoPre (and cartridge of course).

All that said - I am STILL on the fence about Analog! I must get rid of the noise, or I am back to tweaking digital, instead of analog.

Suggestions?

Jeff in Detroit
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