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Cart not parallel after Mint LP alignment?

Howdy,

So after reading about 1000 paragraphs on how good the Mint LP Tractor is - I purchased one and had a marathon session yesterday with my new SL-1210 M5G, AT440MLa and Zupreme headshell...

After all was said and done - the alignment itself took 90 hard minutes - I am finding the cartridge sitting about 5-7 degrees "right" of center. The actual cantilever and stylus are about as dead on as I wanna go with it for now.

Now a comment and a question....

Question: Is this non-parallel result in the headshell normal? It's making me think I may have a bent cantilever or something.

Comment: I have run 10-12 sides thru the rig so far and I must say - I have not yet heard the "revelation" that others have described when comparing their alignments to other protractors or even the white Technics alignment gauge. The rig sounds good...but...what I am missing here.

I must temper the above by saying I have changed phono stages frequently in the last month as well...I was getting nicely familiar with a Bellari VP-130 and then moved that for a Cambridge which lasted less than a week and I now have a Moon LP3 with maybe 25 hours on it...Even my AT440MLa might have 40-50 hours on it as well....

I am thinking that a whole bunch of stuff might need to "burn" in before the system starts to really reveal itself.

But I am very concerned with the stylus/cantilever on the cart...even with all the moves the Mint required...I expected the cartridge to sit straight in the headshell...perhaps expecting too much?

Appreciate any feedback.

Cheers!

VP
vocalpoint
vocalpoint OP
10 posts
 
in case more reassurance is needed, I am hereby agreeing with Vinyladdict, Lewm, and Dougdeacon. If all you care about is getting the cartridge square with the headshell, you could have used the plastic jig that came with the Technics and saved a lt of money. The Mintlp is not just more precise than the Technics jig. It also uses a slightly different alignment geometry, which is why the cartridge must be twisted in relation to the headshell.

Reassurance duly noted. I am officially "past" the "square to the shell" question - but I am surprised how some people have reacted - like it's a federal crime to ask a question and try to understand all the angles. Uh - still learning over here, guys - everyday...sorry to not "know it all".

Anyhoo - now that I have spent a few evenings with this layout - and I am now getting comfy with it's "sound" - it's time to start comparing this setup - cart for cart - to another AT440MLa aligned using the standard Technics gauge.

Using the same 4 or 5 albums - I will play each album with the Minted cart first followed by another run with a standard aligned cart - to find out if there are the kind of differences to the level that some folks are claiming to hear.

Again - thanks again for the comments...

Cheers,

VP
lewm
13,104 posts
 
Dear VP, I guess I did get a little exasperated. But for a while you did not seem to be reading or digesting the responses to your question, which from the get-go contained the information you needed. In fact, you seemed determined to ignore the good advice you got. Anyway, there is a learning curve for all of us, and we all learn from each other and from direct experience. In my case, I had just finished reconciling the fact that the cartridge in my Dynavector tonearm (designed for Stevenson geometry) did not sit square to the headshell after alignment with a protractor designed for Baerwald geometry (the Turntable Basics protractor). That experience brought home to me the effect on cartridge alignment of choosing any one of the major different tonearm geometries, in a way that I had never before appreciated or even cared about. Plus I had read the posts on Vinyl Asylum regarding the Technics tonearm, its shortcomings and its lack of congruence with the nearest formal geometry - Stevenson. I apologize for sounding cranky. Glad you are on the right track at this point.
vocalpoint OP
10 posts
 
Dear VP, I guess I did get a little exasperated. But for a while you did not seem to be reading or digesting the responses to your question, which from the get-go contained the information you needed.

I was reading and digesting everything. I did not say that I agreed with everything nor did I say that I was going to "run" with any of it.

In fact, you seemed determined to ignore the good advice you got. Anyway, there is a learning curve for all of us, and we all learn from each other and from direct experience.

Certainly wasn't ignoring any of the advice...more like collecting it and trying to understand it. Now I do.

That experience brought home to me the effect on cartridge alignment of choosing any one of the major different tonearm geometries, in a way that I had never before appreciated or even cared about.

See - this is what I just reconciled after pouring through this stuff. Until I got the Mint - I never knew a cantilever from a bar of Level soap. I always thought - with all these protractors - if your stylus tip hits the arc at all points - you are golden. Better yet - jam the cart into the Technics jig..adjust and start rockin' 2 minutes later.

I apologize for sounding cranky. Glad you are on the right track at this point.

No prob...the comparison should be fun.

Cheers!

VP
dan_ed
2,451 posts
 
Hi VP,

I've been watching this thread and would like to offer that I have been waiting for this moment when you might catch on that there is more to this vinyl thing than just following the crowd or picking up the latest doo-whacky. ;-) I don't mean to sound like I'm putting you down, but your first post wreaked of someone who jumped without understanding.

Not to worry! I've been there myself, which is why I can appreciate your learning experience.

I think a man has just begun learned to fish for himself.

Loud applause would be called for here!
hesson11
237 posts
 
Vocalpoint,

I look forward to your findings in comparing the two alignments. I haven't read of anyone ever doing this before. But I wouldn't be surprised if the differences are pretty minor. We old, hardbitten audio vets have a habit of hyperbole, I'm afraid. And we often make what others would consider minor changes seem like they are night-and-day. If you do hear a difference, I also wouldn't be surprised if are unable to determine whether one alignment is clearly "better" than the other. As in many comparisons, "different" doesn't always mean "better."

-Bob
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