Changing from an XV1-S

Andromedaaudio wrote;

.....but to say the vpi does not have a "certain level" of sound i think is "a bit" far fetched , sometimes in the audiofile world , things which are cheap and already a long time on the market are considered not interesting( the tri planar is also long on the market is i know ). I have listened at dealer demos/shows to almost all the topcontenders in tables(excl SME) and cartridges and i would not say the high $ arms and tables are "much" better than what i own now.....

with vinyl there is so much info in the grooves waiting to be discovered that there are many levels of performance in tt's and arms (and cartridges and phono stages) as you go up the food chain. if you truely believe " i would not say the high $ arms and tables are 'much' better than what i now own" then you need to get out more. and that is not any disrespect toward your tt; it's a very good one and a good value....and much better than similarly priced tt's from 10 years ago. but there are tt's and arms out there that are a good deal better....one's that are dramatically better, and one's that are amazing.

the good news is that the great performance you are now enjoying can be that much better. and better cartridges have an even higher upside than you might think.

I am curious. I think that most people would tend to agree that at its price point, VPI Classic is certainly a good buy. Let say that if you have a Classic with all the upgrade option ie ring clamp, VTA tower/valhalla wire, SDS which would bring the total to around $4500-5000 (I think), if you want to upgrade from such setup to something that is clearly better, what would you get? How much would you need to spend to really improve upon the Classic?

Peterayer that was indeed madfloyds comment about "certain level"
Okay mike , i thought i had reached pretty much a platform here , but may be there is indeed much more to be discovered in the grooves , in the new " TAX " year i will buy a new turntable probaby a SME 20 /5 inch arm (fremer favorite) which is not that expensive , i read about your " the beat " also interesting .
The point i want to make is just that my current combo just smokes digital , my former wadia 581 doesnt deliver 50 % of what i hear now in terms of being there ,micro dynamics, nuances in voices and " tonal rightness".
Enough to be a very happy listener without much desires actually .

Footnote : i ll be comparing VPI - SME 20/A in 1,5 month time as i have ordered one .

Well I did the demo.

The system was a Feickert Woodpecker which is very nice looking with their own 10" tonearm. We compared the XV1-S, Ortofon A90 and Cadenza Black, Lyra Titan and a Musicmaker III (Moving Iron ?).
the rest of the system was Ayra phonostage, preamp and Acoustic Energy AE 1 MK3.

The overall system sound was quite neutral and musical which was nice.

So to start we used the XV1-S for about 20 minutes so I could get used to the sound. The XV1-S was very different sounding in this system but then that is what I would expect. But it took me about the whole 20 mins to get used to it.

The overall sound with the XV1-S was very good. Very well defined with a nice soundstage and great imaging. I prefer my system sound and presentation but so what.

Next up was the Ortofon A90. This was in a different league. You really can't compare the two of them. The XV1-S is a really good MC whereas the A90 plays above that level and presents the musical stage as if you were listening to a final mix on a master tape. The A90 is also much more musical as it allows you to enjoy the LP and not think about what it's doing right or wrong.
I can say across the whole audio band the A90 is something VERY different.

Back to the XV1-S to adjust my ears. The step down from the A90 was even bigger than going up to it!
Anyway 30 mins later and a cup of coffee... the Lyra Titan went on. Not my bag at all. I'm not too sure if it was because of the A90 that I didn't really like the Titan or because the laid back presentation that I wasn't keen on, but it wasn't for me. The XV1-S I definitely preferred by quite a margin. The Titan would probably suite classical listeners than any other genre. Anyway it wasn't for me.

Next and the last was the Musicmaker. After listening to the XV1-S, A90, Lyra Titan the Musicmaker was an eye opener. It confirmed to me that the 1970's sound is still around! I could NEVER EVER go to an MM or MI. It is really like going back it time. OK it costs about a 1/4 of the others so it's not a fair comparison. Anyway at least I know that MM or MI is not for me.

The Dr Feickert Woodpecker is really nice. I love the design and costs about £1000 more than the VPI Classic. I like the fact it can take any 9" - 12" tonearm on a sliding base - nice touch. It also makes the Classic look a bit cheap. I maybe borrowing one later to see what it is like in my system.

So, what I thought would happen actually happened. It also proves the VPI Classic can tell small differences between cartridges. The XV1-S and Cadenza Black were played side by side at the very end for about 10 mins. The Cadenza Black in this system also has a more vivid presentation around images. It's soundstage is not as big as the XV1-S nor is the bass as good BUT there are small things the XV1-S cannot do which you hear in the Cadenza Black but more so (read: loads) in the A90.

The XV1-S is extremely good though but if you want what some consider the very best, and I can see why, check out the A90. It is VERY different in what it does and how it does it BUT you may end up falling in love with it.