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Apocalypse Now?—Technics sp10 problem s

I’d been enjoying my Technics sp-10 mkii for a couple of months now but recently it’s sending out signs of giving up the ghost.

When I first bought it, the start/stop function was halting in the sense that I would have to push the button several times in order for it to perform the function. Independently of that, I bought bearing grease and after adding some drops, the halting start/stop problem more or less disappeared. Great.

But then the strobe light went out. It still comes on occasionally but it’s intermittent. Unless that’s a sign of deeper ailments though, I could care less about that.

Worse: if I play a record now after first turning on the TT, the speed is obviously haywire. One symptom is that the gear mechanism is clearly audible in the form of an unusual and grating grinding sound. Playing records when it’s like this is of course out of the question. The good news is that, for now, if I let the motor spin by itself (without the cartridge on) for about 10 minutes or so, the issue goes away. That is, the speed is dead on for the remainder of the listening session (I played it for almost 8 hours yesterday with no problems), and the grinding noise is gone. The bad news is that all this may be just a sign of an impending apocalyptic failure.

So, I'd like to deal with the issue before it gets to that stage. Can someone suggest the cause? Or better: the cure. Or, alternatively, and best of all since I’m not handy enough to actually fix anything complex, can anyone suggest a reputable service shop where I could bring it? I live in Los Angeles. I’m hesitant to ship it because I don’t have the motor clamp for shipping. For all I know, that may be the original cause since the seller shipped mine without the clamp. I guess I could have a clamp fabricated if that’s my only choice.

It’s a wonderful TT and would hate for it to die so soon in our journey together. Final question: if there’s a repair shop, should I go ahead and replace capacitors, etc..? What are people’s opinions on that?

Thanks.
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banquo363 OP
371 posts
 
As I said, my TT was used for broadcast. Those guys drilled a tonearm hole right through the Technics metal top. When I first got the TT, I mounted their tonearm into that hole. The spindle to pivot distance was perfect but I could not get the correct height so that VTA was always way too high. Either they didn't care or else had a very low hanging cart. So, having no plinth, I had to fabricate a separate board to hold the tonearm. Obviously, there's no point in comparing the two set ups, since the former was so compromised.

And, to be clear, I'm not saying plinthless is better. It just sounds so good that I don't feel the need currently to spend money on fabricating a plinth. This is fortuitous since I'll have a hefty repair bill coming my way, I'm sure.

Would it sound better with a plinth? I hope so, since that way I can get better sound without buying a different TT. But, as Ct0517 said, tonearm flexibility is a strong consideration in favor of going without. I'm new to vinyl and want to be able to play around with different arms in the future.

lewm
13,118 posts
 
Banquo, Don't sweat it. You did good. Actually, the only thing I don't like about the Mk2 and the Mk3 is that square escutcheon that surrounds the platter. The square shape t makes it quite difficult to mate the turntable with more than one tonearm and/or to use a standard 9-inch arm that is offset for a VTA tower, like the Triplanar, Talea, and Reed tonearms. 10.5- to 12-inch arms work much better. That's probably why those guys drilled the hole. Sounds like your tonearm is secured to the chassis, not free-standing.
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banquo363 OP
371 posts
 
Sounds like your tonearm is secured to the chassis, not free-standing.

No, it is independent of the chassis. I drilled a hole in some plyboard I had laying around and mounted the tonearm on it. I then screwed that piece onto more boards to give the whole thing some weight. The boards sit on 4 Herbie's tenderfoots. This is obviously a temporary solution since the boards are not heavy enough to resist inadvertent bumps--which then messes with geometry.

Halcro's solution of machining 25lb tonearm rests would be ideal but too rich for my blood.
ct0517's avatar
ct0517
2,041 posts
 
Dear Lewn
I will post a link to some pics later that will answer your questions.
It is all very simple actually. The flexibility to setup arms when not restricted by a plinth is huge. You can move the table in place and not touch the arm if you wanted to. I discussed and exchanged the ideas and pics of the ET setup with Bruce as well. Hearing is believing as they say.
Standard is a very strong word – to me it implies constraints and rules to follow- this is a hobby about passion and enjoyment – constraints and rules don’t fit in - lets use guidelines.
Manufacturers have to follow standards and guidelines for their products. its up to us as users to push those guidelines (common way of doing it) then the demand follows if it’s an idea that works and manufacturers have to change. Look I could be in a plinth again - who knows – all I know is I am enjoying my music and not worrying about whether I "did" the right thing.
Regardless –I have learned that the table itself is 3rd in line of importance. Once you have solid reliable platter speed have dealt with motor vibrations and the sp10 has NO RUMBLE by design you are good to go.
This setup I think further isolates more so the arm and cartridge which are 1 and 2 in importance to me from any motor vibrations. I see more and more high end manufacturers using arm pods now and I think you will see more to come. I think my sound improvement was because the arm is no longer on the same base where the motor is turning where it picks up more vibrations regardless. So the sp10 in the plinth or not is not the issue here. You can still put the sp10 itself in a plinth if u want – but aren’t u adding another layer or stage then.
Look I also have a VPI TNT with another ET arm and I did ab testing with both the sp10 in the plinth and the TNT. They both make beautiful music.
lewm
13,118 posts
 
Ct0517, I guess I come across as being more dogmatic about this than I actually am. Really, I am all in favor of doing whatever you like with your equipment. I enjoy the debate, and I can think of arguments on either side of almost any issue where the well-being of my fellow man is not at issue. It's really too bad that we each cannot hear the others' turntables in a controlled setting, to find out more about how these many different ideas work in practice.

In the context of your post above, you are reiterating what I wrote previously: There are two entirely separate issues: (i) plinth vs no-plinth (for direct-drive), and (ii) arm coupled to bearing or independent of bearing. On the plinth issue, you guys have stimulated me to give it a try (maybe) with my Denon DP80, which is very near identical in size and shape to the Victor that Halcro uses. Of one thing I am sure: how one seats the chassis on the shelf will still make a big difference, so one guy's no-plinth could sound a lot different from another guy's no-plinth. (I hope we agree that the chassis needs to sit on or in something that at least inhibits it from walking off the shelf. Newton's 3rd Law is not abrogated after start-up.) On issue #2, I think I will go my way for now. However, I was thinking that the most expensive Kuzma set-up features their straight line tonearm mounted separately from their top turntable, much as you have done, albeit both are on brass pedestals that look to be VERY heavy. I don't know anyone else who sells a system like that. All the other tts with pod-mounted tonearms are using pivoted types.
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