Apocalypse Now?—Technics sp10 problem s


I’d been enjoying my Technics sp-10 mkii for a couple of months now but recently it’s sending out signs of giving up the ghost.

When I first bought it, the start/stop function was halting in the sense that I would have to push the button several times in order for it to perform the function. Independently of that, I bought bearing grease and after adding some drops, the halting start/stop problem more or less disappeared. Great.

But then the strobe light went out. It still comes on occasionally but it’s intermittent. Unless that’s a sign of deeper ailments though, I could care less about that.

Worse: if I play a record now after first turning on the TT, the speed is obviously haywire. One symptom is that the gear mechanism is clearly audible in the form of an unusual and grating grinding sound. Playing records when it’s like this is of course out of the question. The good news is that, for now, if I let the motor spin by itself (without the cartridge on) for about 10 minutes or so, the issue goes away. That is, the speed is dead on for the remainder of the listening session (I played it for almost 8 hours yesterday with no problems), and the grinding noise is gone. The bad news is that all this may be just a sign of an impending apocalyptic failure.

So, I'd like to deal with the issue before it gets to that stage. Can someone suggest the cause? Or better: the cure. Or, alternatively, and best of all since I’m not handy enough to actually fix anything complex, can anyone suggest a reputable service shop where I could bring it? I live in Los Angeles. I’m hesitant to ship it because I don’t have the motor clamp for shipping. For all I know, that may be the original cause since the seller shipped mine without the clamp. I guess I could have a clamp fabricated if that’s my only choice.

It’s a wonderful TT and would hate for it to die so soon in our journey together. Final question: if there’s a repair shop, should I go ahead and replace capacitors, etc..? What are people’s opinions on that?

Thanks.
Ag insider logo xs@2xbanquo363
Dear Lewn
I will post a link to some pics later that will answer your questions.
It is all very simple actually. The flexibility to setup arms when not restricted by a plinth is huge. You can move the table in place and not touch the arm if you wanted to. I discussed and exchanged the ideas and pics of the ET setup with Bruce as well. Hearing is believing as they say.
Standard is a very strong word – to me it implies constraints and rules to follow- this is a hobby about passion and enjoyment – constraints and rules don’t fit in - lets use guidelines.
Manufacturers have to follow standards and guidelines for their products. its up to us as users to push those guidelines (common way of doing it) then the demand follows if it’s an idea that works and manufacturers have to change. Look I could be in a plinth again - who knows – all I know is I am enjoying my music and not worrying about whether I "did" the right thing.
Regardless –I have learned that the table itself is 3rd in line of importance. Once you have solid reliable platter speed have dealt with motor vibrations and the sp10 has NO RUMBLE by design you are good to go.
This setup I think further isolates more so the arm and cartridge which are 1 and 2 in importance to me from any motor vibrations. I see more and more high end manufacturers using arm pods now and I think you will see more to come. I think my sound improvement was because the arm is no longer on the same base where the motor is turning where it picks up more vibrations regardless. So the sp10 in the plinth or not is not the issue here. You can still put the sp10 itself in a plinth if u want – but aren’t u adding another layer or stage then.
Look I also have a VPI TNT with another ET arm and I did ab testing with both the sp10 in the plinth and the TNT. They both make beautiful music.
Ct0517, I guess I come across as being more dogmatic about this than I actually am. Really, I am all in favor of doing whatever you like with your equipment. I enjoy the debate, and I can think of arguments on either side of almost any issue where the well-being of my fellow man is not at issue. It's really too bad that we each cannot hear the others' turntables in a controlled setting, to find out more about how these many different ideas work in practice.

In the context of your post above, you are reiterating what I wrote previously: There are two entirely separate issues: (i) plinth vs no-plinth (for direct-drive), and (ii) arm coupled to bearing or independent of bearing. On the plinth issue, you guys have stimulated me to give it a try (maybe) with my Denon DP80, which is very near identical in size and shape to the Victor that Halcro uses. Of one thing I am sure: how one seats the chassis on the shelf will still make a big difference, so one guy's no-plinth could sound a lot different from another guy's no-plinth. (I hope we agree that the chassis needs to sit on or in something that at least inhibits it from walking off the shelf. Newton's 3rd Law is not abrogated after start-up.) On issue #2, I think I will go my way for now. However, I was thinking that the most expensive Kuzma set-up features their straight line tonearm mounted separately from their top turntable, much as you have done, albeit both are on brass pedestals that look to be VERY heavy. I don't know anyone else who sells a system like that. All the other tts with pod-mounted tonearms are using pivoted types.
I found a guy near me who says he can fix my TT (not Brooks Berdan). When I described the problem to him over the phone he seemed to know exactly what was wrong. We'll see whether his confidence is warranted. Evidently, he can machine TT parts as well, so perhaps I can get him to make me a suitable tonearm pod. Meet all my TT needs at once!

Lewm: I see the distinction you're making and have read the arguments pro/con for plinths, but am not familiar with the arguments pro/con for coupling tonearms to bearing. It would be great if you could rehearse some of those for me.

The left most foot of my TT sits on the left edge of the platform it rests on. If the TT moved position even slightly the whole thing would have either fallen over by now or else be off the edge. Neither has happened. TT walking is not really a serious problem I think--at least with the Mk II.
Banquo363 - great that you found a contact to work on your TT.

With the ET arm if anything moved the distortion would be audible on the last track. So far so good.


Lewn - the great thing about this project was it was cheap to find out if it worked in my setup. 3 legs for the TT and spikes for the armboard - you probably have spares lying around and about $75 - $100 in material for the armboard. Doesnt have to be pretty, just functional for now. I listen with lights dimmed anyway :)

here is a link to a site that I added some pictures of my project to:

If you want some closeups send me a note and I will email to you.

http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/view_userimages.php?user_id=5181

I got the metal from Metal Supermarkets. The smaller steel armboard was close to 20 pounds. I was obsessed with making it heavy but Halcro rightly pointed out in the nude TT thread about the magnetics problem with steel so I made an aluminum one - twice as big and about 17 lbs. I put a picture of one of the store racks on the site for you so you can see what is available - they cut any size pieces on the spot for you.

I will be making a pod for the VPI JMW 12 pivot arm soon.

Appreciate comments and any tips on making my set up better.

This project was a lot of fun and it got me through the holidays with two teenagers :).

Chris

Dear Banquo and Ct0517,
Great to see you guys trying out the 'Nude Turntable' principle on the Technics SP 10 MkII. It seems your experiences support Raul's proposition that the 'Nude' SP10 may be better than or at least equal to, a plinthed one?
Photos of your set- ups would be informative for all of us and may inspire others to try this meted?
Cheers