EMT 927 vs. Micro Seiki 5000 or 8000 - different?

At 1990 for a brief period of 4 months, I use to listen via the EMT 950 that comes to me as a trade for my Piere Lurnee J4/SL5. To my personal taste, this TT failed to please me with it's perspective performance. But then, the same failure at these present days exposed by the Shindo 301 also! It seems to me that these 2 TT plays the music without the usual hi-fi trends, but mostly in a plain & unpretentious manner that shamelessly trascends the flamboyant & glitzy reproduction by refusing to analyse the signal into myriad pieces of innermost details, in favor for a more humble, naturalistic & coherent performance.
There are not any similarities to their way they play music, other than the above mentioned AND ...
... their dull, dark, clumsy, cloudy & veiled character.
IMHO there are quality layers of this holistic view & uncontrived perspective, depended by the offered clarity, transparency, speed & dynamic impact. An analogy between a 92db paper cone full-range driver & a 106db compression driver. Or between the Grado wood body cartridges & the London Decca Reference.
I agree that the EMT 950 was designed for practical studio priorities & not for top performance. I remember clearly my preferance for my Denon DP 80 / SME V / Grasshopper III M those days, that it was better overall, being more genuinly honest & balanced in it's own monitor way.
I can't say a thing about the 927 or 930 as I've never seen them in person, but I like the Idler drive sound even more than the finest Direct drives, for the emotional involvement that can engage when critically executed avoiding overdamping that can mask & veil their clarity.
Today I've found peace of mind with a Thorens TD124mkII and I'm almost done with my Lenco GL75 project and what I've found so far to be the most important thing in our hobby, is the learned & practiced skill that comes after many wrong decisions & disappointing results :
There are many paths to find pleasure in building a successful system. ... And the certain way to discarce this hobby is by having high expectations for ANY project in order to justify your expense. So, the rest of us with modest length of pockets, lets get over this giant iconoclastic EMT 927 & put some love & devotion into our formal way to fight our demons. Me too I've had the Studer C37 and I was staying ecstatic upon it's innards, but I felt OK when I substitute it for the Teac Z 7000 tape deck and even better the day that I got rid of this also, in order to dismantle my worries about their repairing needs.
You see the peace of mind only comes when you can listen to your fav music without such worries
.... unless of course your budjet is unlimited.
My point is that :
There are conponents that in pursuit of the art of music reproduction, are designed without compromise. But the cost & the difficulty of purchase, of maintenance service, of repairing service & even handling them without problems could be a serious insulting factor to our state of calm.
And there are some humble but inventive & sophisticated (ie: Lenco L75/Technics EPA100, Denon DP80/SME 312S ) that could bring a careless enjoyment without breaking our nerves & our bank account.
Are we having fun by collecting these mythical titans or we just care for a more faithful & puristic perpoduction ?
Can you answer honestly ?

Hi Geoch, I see you have quite an experience with TTs and idlers as well. You are completely right when you are indicating listening to fine music is possible without owning special top notch gear. If you are carefully selecting and maybe modifying some fine pieces of audio gear you are on the safe side. It is only about a few additional improvements which I rate as of some importance for me, nevertheless it is also fun investigating and playing with such units, not counting the adventurous crest searching in the lost market for such a TT if you decided going for one.

I do remember when I imported my well preserved old Nakamichi 1000 which spent its life in Hawai finding its way via the States to me. Having arrived at me I had to look for a solution on an electrical part only one guy in Germany could repair. I had to travel with the Naka from Munich to the North Sea crossing the full length of Germany.

Your point on service hits the mark. Nevertheless Studer, EMT or MS products are build for eternity. I never had a problem with my Micros. Luckily around me are some wise men having worked for Studer, EMT etc. trying to continue the tradition of these quality addicted philosophy. When it comes to servicing I may count on them.

Having Fun? Yes I do!

I'm so grateful that you did'nt get me wrong.
Thank you for your kindness & intellectual plurality.

Geoch,
Well at one time I played a/b between Micro Seiki SX8000 and fully serviced well plinthed (slate) good armed (FR66s or Davinci Grandezza) finely tipped Garrard 301. Some advised me "now way" oh are you crazy, never....well it was close for me. Oh not from the "high end" perspective on no the MS shinned in that arena...perfect reproduction? No idea really. The only thing is that the 301 got me to listen to more records. The MS was slanted towards lets analyse the record. Do not get me wrong the MX SX8000 is a fantastic TT by all means and made for very serious analogue playing. In the end the MS had me overall. I notwithstanding missed the "enjoy" factor of the 301. On soprano vocals the MS had that "inner" image that the 301 missed. The 301 misted that side of the interpretation. The 301 does let the " atmosphere" of live jazz come to you in a way that the MS does not, the MS cuts through that into the performance. Can live with a 301 and any good TT so long as I have my records and have access to more of them. We all know of audiophiles “audiophiles” that host “glossy magazine” kit, hoping for deeper pockets, yet own next to no records…. Well the price of any “high end” silver litz cable that adds little vs a “regular” cable can get you one hell of a lot of records. But this is a hobby and I respect all of its facets.

I am not one who can accommodate (or want?) to have more than one TT so I am in single partner category. The MS was that one. Until…I had the opportunity to go to Italy and at that time stepped into a “good” room that has 301/EMT997 & Thomas Schick, EMT 930/EMT/139st and 927/Ortofon/139st at a good place in Italy near to Parma, birth city of Verdi… a museum dedicated to sound reproduction and really worth the visit showing the most ancient and exotic vintage kit to the Ipod. Anyway the 930 betters the 301 whist still having that “idler” sound, the 927 takes it all to another level adding the detail and resolution that the MS has.

For the idler “ears” the 930/139st/b is the “bargain”…Indeed, you can get a fully refurbished one with phono stage for 35/40% of a 927. It will cost less than a Garrard 301/decent plinth/arm and separate phono stage of similar calibre, takes up far less space (if that is of concern), enable “true” mono with the TMD25 and 139st/b setting to mono…and yes you will listen to more records, buy more of them…

Okay if those “idler ears” get to hear the 927 they will tell your brain to find a way to getting one. Oh yes! no choice of arm, no variations on cartridges, no choice of cable (short of the one from 139st to amp or preamp)…so you are stuck? No… simply at the place one should “be” accepting the limits (choice entails that) and enjoying the rest of it!

All fun!

You bring me memories from the :

Shindo "Latour" 38000euro (EMT 927)
-Vs-
Shindo "604" 18000euro (EMT 930)

Unfortunatelly I choose the Carfrae LBH instead, in favor of the higher level of permitted experimentation.
By this same logic I went to the side of Lenco L75 to explore the possibilities, and my latest purchase was the SAEC WE-308SX to satisfy my secret project (changing the armtube!).

I'm a DIY junkie. I'm addicted to the flexibility of personalize my demands upon everything.
I don't care to build it by myself. That is not the point.
I have this obsession with the custom & unique crafts to the point that it scares me when I realize the short time that left to enjoy the music (after all these projects).
I can't escape of myself, but at least I do try not to keep very high expectations, by compromising my demands to the most feasible & unsentimental down to Earth humble plans.
But the most necessary & important thing that I have to do, is always -always- advise money wise. 'Cause it really matters what remains in our soul, not right after a new purchase, but when we can relax and live with it in the long run without regrets & conflicts about it's value in our life.
By this point of view, the fully loaded EMT 930 and (I insist to add) the Shindo 604, may are the safest way to carelessly enjoy the music without taking the endless & tiresome path of exploring the possibilities.
But then, how many of us can manage to escape and make the shortcut ?