Soundsmith Straingauge SG-200 cartridge system

I've never heard a Decca London Ref, sorry.

The original SG I heard (at RMAF a few years ago) had oodles of dynamics, a full frequency range, speed, weight, heft, etc. Everything it did it did well and nothing was distorted. However, it lost or severely attenuated the complex harmonics we're used to hearing on two familiar Vivaldi and Handel LP's. FWIW, we hear similar behavior from most SS phono stages and amps. Even the best ones we've heard (like Raul's original Essential phono/line stage) lose the lowest levels of musical harmonics. They simply fall below the sound floor of the component and are not retrieved.

People who listen to rock or other amplified/electronically manipulated music might not notice or care. We listen almost entirely to classical, with a heavy emphasis on original/early instrument recordings. Reproducing harmonic complexities with completeness and accuracy is essential to reproducing the actual sound of such music.

My resident physics/materials science genius predicted harmonic attenuation before we ever heard the SG. According to him it's virtually inevitable due to the the nature of strain gauges (don't ask me to explain the science, I'd make a fool of myself).

***
Lew,

We haven't heard an Astatic. I'll have to dig around the pile to remind myself what that MM is. I do remember that Paul and I both said that no sub-$2K LOMC that we've heard outplayed it in any significant way. A steal at 1/10 the price (whatever it is, lol).

OTOH, the MI we auditioned a couple years ago was unlistenable (to us). Paul instantly stood up and left the room, a familiar sign that something was seriously flawed and paining his hyper-sensitivity. I struggled along for a couple of LPs, tweaking this and that. I gave up once I realized that what I was trying to fix (a phase-shifted echo or ghost of each waveform) was inherent and unfixable.

It took me 30 minutes to figure that out. It took Paul 30 seconds. That's a fair estimate of the proportion between our hearing and our IQ's. ;)

Paul knew nothing about this cartridge except what he heard, not even the name. At dinner he asked, "What kind of cartridge was that? It must employ a different technology than MM or MC to behave like that. Does it work by induction or something?"

He scares me sometimes.

What? I thought everyone knew that induction sounds funny.
But seriously, folks, I have no idea what Paul heard, because my auditory acuity, or lack thereof, is more like yours than his, but I do think I hear a certain character in MI cartridges vs the other two major types. For that matter, I think we could easily agree that MMs sound "different" from MC, as a class. Having said that, I am sure I could be fooled in a single-blind test, if I had to guess whether I was listening to an MM, MI, or MC. Which gets us back to Moving Flux (MF). Astatic is the only one I know about, unless MF is synonymous with Induced Magnet, a la some Grado and Acutex products.

There are good MI cartridges as well as bad ones, I'm sure.

Spiritofmusic,
I wouldn't touch a Decca. I have set up and listened to probably 15-20 samples, mostly tweaked by Garrot Bros. They have no cantilver, no compliance, and require robust tonearms to manage them. Although they are blindingly quick, they are unforgiving of suboptimal set up and at worst damage records when not set up properly. They load best at around 22k. Best arms are Zeta's, Ekos.
With regard to the 103 option, I prefer the 103 to the 103R which can sound overly warm and rolled off. I ran a 103 modified with Boron cantilever and Weinz Parabolic tip in an ET2 air bearing arm and this was superbly musical. I could happily go back to this from my Ikeda/Koetsu Black/Dynavector Nova 13D all of which are much more expensive.
I also note on the ET high compliance Moving Magnets worked amazingly well and should not be discounted.
My suggestion would be to try your current cartridges first as is before you make any decisions.

Dear Dougdeacon: +++++ " The original SG I heard (at RMAF a few years ago) had oodles of dynamics, a full frequency range, speed, weight, heft, etc. Everything it did it did well and nothing was distorted. However, it lost or severely attenuated the complex harmonics we're used to hearing on two familiar Vivaldi and Handel LP's.... " ++++++

+++ " lose the lowest levels of musical harmonics. They simply fall below the sound floor of the component and are not retrieved.

People who listen to rock or other amplified/electronically manipulated music might not notice or care. We listen almost entirely to classical, with a heavy emphasis on original/early instrument recordings. Reproducing harmonic complexities with completeness and accuracy is essential to reproducing the actual sound of such music. " ++++

this is not the first time that you post about harmonics and I think that on each time " things " are not very clear because IMHO you was not precise, I mean what harmonics are you talking about?: in which frequency ranges? it is the 2th, the 3th, the 5th, the 6th, its combinations or what? how any one of us with the same LPs can even figure what are you talking on harmonics with out be more precise about?

I think I know both of you ( about listen music experiences/habilities. ) more or less as you know me too.
I know all the " implications " on the music experiences on harmonics and its main influences on any music experience.

My take on the SS is that its main " trouble " is about frequency response deviations against any other LOMC/MM/MI cartridges due that does not performs with the RIAA eq. ( as any other cartridge/phono stage and as the recording was recorded. ), the SS has its own eq. curve. IMHO there is no reason that the SS can't handle music harmonics but its frequency deviations makes a different tone/color. I heard it in a very good audio system and that's was what I heard.

As you I heard in my system all the cartridges you name it but the Olympos that I heard in the same system I heard the SS along all them I heard in my system the Goldfinger, Coralstone, AT Supreme and the like. All of them good performers with its own trade offs.

IMHO the SS is a cartridge that can fulfil some persons music priorities that likes those deviations/colorations/distortions. I know you don't like it, you are to polite about, as neither I. Our priorities are different but other people are different too and some of them love it.

You and Stringreen posted to hear it before decide to buy it and I'm with both of you the only " thing " I can say is that we have to hear it for some hours ( not brief way ) against other top cartridges and then decide about.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.

Thanks, Raul. Our ears/priorities certainly do differ in some ways, always have, but we seem to have reached similar conclusions about the Strain Gauge (I assume you meant SG, not SS?). You may be perfectly right that it displays other behaviors besides harmonic attenuation, behaviors which bother your ears more than mine.

All one can advise anyone is what you and I have both said, listen for yourself and decide.

P.S. With regard to whether it was the 2nd, 3rd, 4th or nth order harmonics which went missing, my recollection (several years old now) is that basically they ALL went missing. If some were attenuated more than others my ears aren't good enough say.

I do know it was much harder to distinguish between (say) an 18th C. oboe and a 20th C. one. The difference between those two instruments is vast when heard live, and quite clear with all those LOMC's too. The SG lost a lot of the distinctions.